Thread: Titan Mode!

That is exactly what I was just telling MaximusBoomus. Even if we could get it to work, which we can, that doesn't mean once we switch to a DLC map that the server won't empty out. It may be worth a manual test an upcoming weekend on one of the servers though.

So in the field, how would it work?

We certainly can't be chaning the maps every time someone without them wants to join. Maybe I'm not following, but if it takes map shenanigans, it's not practical. We'd never finish a map.

I think, but correct me if I am wrong gen, what he was thinking was set the map rotation for stock maps, then once the server is full set next map as DLCA map. Then when it changes it goes to a DLC map and boots people without the map, but hopefully the server stays full enough to fill back up.

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Originally Posted by CivilWars

I think, but correct me if I am wrong gen, what he was thinking was set the map rotation for stock maps, then once the server is full set next map as DLCA map. Then when it changes it goes to a DLC map and boots people without the map, but hopefully the server stays full enough to fill back up.

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At that point (after the switch is made to the DLC) doesn't it become a DLC server? Meaning that after that, someone who doesn't have the DLC can't join the server until a restart clears the DLC server designation. Seems like a long way to go for very little, if any (since the server will lose those without the DLC as soon as a DLC map comes up), gain.

Maybe I'm still not following.

That is essentially the solution. The server is only marked as a DLC server when there is a DLC map in the rotation. So if you control what the next map is by only ever having one map in the maplist you can allow non-DLC people to play when the map is on a base map and they will be kicked or not able to join when either a. the current map is ending and you have changed the maplist to a DLC map, or b. the current map playing is a DLC map.

Now obviously controlling the maps like this would be a hassle, but lets just set that issue aside for the moment since it would hardly matter if we did a manual test of this setup and we lose most of the population and it doesn't fill back up in a reasonable amount of time.

Originally Posted by gehn

That is essentially the solution. The server is only marked as a DLC server when there is a DLC map in the rotation. So if you control what the next map is by only ever having one map in the maplist you can allow non-DLC people to play when the map is on a base map and they will be kicked or not able to join when either a. the current map is ending and you have changed the maplist to a DLC map, or b. the current map playing is a DLC map.

Now obviously controlling the maps like this would be a hassle, but lets just set that issue aside for the moment since it would hardly matter if we did a manual test of this setup and we lose most of the population and it doesn't fill back up in a reasonable amount of time.

It sounds like you would basically be back at square 1 as soon as a DLC map came up. The server would empty those who didn't have the map, and we would be left with those who had it and hoping that others who had it would then refill the server. Might as well just keep it a DLC server so as not to piss people off who joined thinking they would be able to stay (since, if they were random connects, the server would show to have the same maps they had).

I'm not sure what we would gain by doing this if, as soon as a DLC map came up, we would lose all of the people we gained by "tricking" the system. Sure, we could fill the server up, but at what cost? We could also turn people off to TPG, because in their eyes, it was us who purposely disconnected them.

*edit* Not to mention losing people who are actually looking for servers with the DLC. If our server shows that we don't have it, it gets passed on by the very people we are looking for to keep it full.

Lol, yes dex. I know this and you know this. But that wasn't what you kept bringing up.

It's too bad that EA didn't stick with just disconnecting people when a map thay didn't have came up. Not much we can do about it.

They did keep it that way and I went out to try to show you that it still can work that way, it is completely possible and could be automated. There are potential advantages to trying it out this way though on one of the servers. It gives you a message on why you were kicked from the server about not having the right content. We don't actually know who on the server does and doesn't have premium/DLCs so for all we know while for some odd reason we had issues priming a DLC marked server we may not have the same issue priming a non-DLC marked server then switching to DLC maps.

How about we set aside any issues of getting it setup to be automated to work for now and just focus on some more testing. Specifically if we did setup a server like this would we actually lose people because its all speculation right now.

Originally Posted by gehn

Lol, yes dex. I know this and you know this. But that wasn't what you kept bringing up.



They did keep it that way and I went out to try to show you that it still can work that way, it is completely possible and could be automated. There are potential advantages to trying it out this way though on one of the servers. It gives you a message on why you were kicked from the server about not having the right content. We don't actually know who on the server does and doesn't have premium/DLCs so for all we know while for some odd reason we had issues priming a DLC marked server we may not have the same issue priming a non-DLC marked server then switching to DLC maps.

How about we set aside any issues of getting it setup to be automated to work for now and just focus on some more testing. Specifically if we did setup a server like this would we actually lose people because its all speculation right now.

But it doesn't work the same. At all.

No shenanigans were needed. Those who didn't have the map would be disconnected, but could reconnect as soon as the map was done. No server restarts, no trickery involved. EA did not keep it that way. They changed it. It's different now than it was. It was better before.

Was Civil disconnected as soon as a DLC map came up? Was he able to reconnect without a restart after the change was made back to a stock map? Is the server marked as a DLC server once a DLC map is being played? If so.....what's the point?

I'll ask again.....What would we be gaining by this if all of the people we were able to get on the server (who did not have the DLC) were immediately disconnected when a DLC map came up? Most likely, they would never join our server again. The message it sends is that we used your ass to fill our server, but now we want to play maps that you don't have, so screw you......Maybe you can come play with us for a little bit tommorow. I know I would be peeved, especially if I joined thinking I could play all of the maps in the rotation.

Those who didn't have the map would be disconnected, but could reconnect as soon as the map was done.

This is true for what I have done.

No server restarts, no trickery involved.

No server restarts are required for this to work. You are correct that it was a better setup before but if it works and the difference is 95% just seen by server admins whats it matter?

Was Civil disconnected as soon as a DLC map came up? Yes
Was he able to reconnect without a restart after the change was made back to a stock map? Yes
Is the server marked as a DLC server once a DLC map is being played? Yes
If so.....what's the point? It isn't marked as a DLC server when a DLC map isn't being played or next in like to be played (which we wouldn't set to be next in line to be played until the very end of the round).

I don't know what would be gained yet, you don't know either. That is why I think it should be tested for us, that is what I have been saying and I'll say it again. We honestly can only guess what is going to happen until we try and it is worth the effort to try. Even if it means we get a third server for a month running just to try so as not to fuck up the existing ones.

Let me ask you a question, you are rightfully concerned about pissing people off and losing population, but this essentially becomes the same setup as BF2 had so you must have had the same issues there. What did you guys do about them? If your answer is you didn't have the problems that you are concerned about then great! We may not have those problems either and you can't say we will because we don't know.

You seemed upset that EA changed it so people can't play and just be disconnected when a map they don't have pops up. I'm saying that isn't the case. I took the problem, accepted it, and said to myself "what can I do about it."

Now I'm saying this could be something not seen too much in BF4, maybe even unique for TPG. Can we use this to our advantage? Let's do some testing and find out because we won't know otherwise. That's all I'm saying. I want to make that abundantly clear. We don't know what this could mean for TPG, but it seems like something others don't have and could either help us or not. Let's find out! If the higher ups feel like it isn't worth the time and effort to try it then fine, no skin off my back but we can't say it isn't possible and we certainly shouldn't start guessing on what would happen since we can easily find out for sure. Now this is becoming tiresome to me and I think I've clearly explained everything that did or didn't need explaining. I rest my case.

Originally Posted by gehn

This is true for what I have done.



No server restarts are required for this to work. You are correct that it was a better setup before but if it works and the difference is 95% just seen by server admins whats it matter?

Was Civil disconnected as soon as a DLC map came up? Yes
Was he able to reconnect without a restart after the change was made back to a stock map? Yes
Is the server marked as a DLC server once a DLC map is being played? Yes
If so.....what's the point? It isn't marked as a DLC server when a DLC map isn't being played or next in like to be played (which we wouldn't set to be next in line to be played until the very end of the round).

I don't know what would be gained yet, you don't know either. That is why I think it should be tested for us, that is what I have been saying and I'll say it again. We honestly can only guess what is going to happen until we try and it is worth the effort to try. Even if it means we get a third server for a month running just to try so as not to fuck up the existing ones.

Let me ask you a question, you are rightfully concerned about pissing people off and losing population, but this essentially becomes the same setup as BF2 had so you must have had the same issues there. What did you guys do about them? If your answer is you didn't have the problems that you are concerned about then great! We may not have those problems either and you can't say we will because we don't know.

You seemed upset that EA changed it so people can't play and just be disconnected when a map they don't have pops up. I'm saying that isn't the case. I took the problem, accepted it, and said to myself "what can I do about it."

Now I'm saying this could be something not seen too much in BF4, maybe even unique for TPG. Can we use this to our advantage? Let's do some testing and find out because we won't know otherwise. That's all I'm saying. I want to make that abundantly clear. We don't know what this could mean for TPG, but it seems like something others don't have and could either help us or not. Let's find out! If the higher ups feel like it isn't worth the time and effort to try it then fine, no skin off my back but we can't say it isn't possible and we certainly shouldn't start guessing on what would happen since we can easily find out for sure. Now this is becoming tiresome to me and I think I've clearly explained everything that did or didn't need explaining. I rest my case.

For Christ's sake Gehn......I'm not trying to argue with you. I'm trying to fully understand what you are trying to tell me. Do me the solid of not telling me what I know or don't know (because you have no idea, either way.....and it's disrespectful to someone who wants the same results you do), and cut the "I told you so" bs in about half, and we'll be golden.

Sure.....You can make, trick, or another word for it would be to glitch the server browser into allowing one who doesn't have the DLC to be allowed to play on our server. It isn't the same as it was in BF2 simply because you have to use a glitch.....trick....whatever to do it. No automation needed. No risking pissing people off, or breaking some osbcure EA EULA for server providors. It just worked. We ran Highway Tampa because we billed ourselves as "full rotation". Usually, one of us would just manually skip the map. If we didn't, we played it. People who didn't have the map were able to rejoin as soon as the map was done.

Getting all caught up in the mechanics of getting it to work ignores the elephant in the room. If we can't prime the server with the DLC, why bother with the DLC at all? Either people have it and want to play it, or they don't. The 32 man server is filling every day now that it is getting some love, so the DLC is just sprinkles on the cupcake. We will absolutely give it another shot on the 32 man, but if it kills the population, why bother?

We do know one thing. We tried China Rising, and it failed. Maybe because it was right when it came out (close to Christmas), and not as many had the Premium, or the Sun was in Jupiter, or there just wasn't interest at the time. Either way, after spending hours trying to get the server to prime and failing, we pulled the CR maps, and the server was full in an hour. That was a couple of months ago, and times change quickly, so I'm willing to give it another go on the 32 man. I hope to Hell it works, because I LOVED the Titan maps in 2142.

Just know that I am thankful to have people like you around who want nothing more than to make us more successful, and are willing to go the extra mile to make it happen. By no means am I trying to argue with you, just understand your theory fully. It's in my job description to play Devil's Advocate, so if it helps me paint a fuller picture for myself and the other eyes reading this, I will.

Hopefully, it's a moot point when the server is running Titan Mode, and there is a line out the door. Then I don't think either of us would care as we will both be dodging bullets and raiding Titans.