Second debate

**SovietDooM** · 10-17-12, 04:29 PM

Originally Posted by triggerhappy2005

I was able to correct it.

So was I,

**triggerhappy2005** · 10-17-12, 04:37 PM

Why is Obama dripping?

**Alundil** · 10-17-12, 04:38 PM

Originally Posted by CivilWars

The real winner in this debate is me, since I didn't watch a second of it.

Civil sent me a link to this thread.....

All I have to say on this

Originally Posted by facebook

I feel sad that my friends and people that I respect have been duped into thinking our political class is truly "working for them". That ended a long time ago.

2012...nothing changes.

Rah rah. The R and D pennant waving is sadly amusing.

Originally Posted by facebook

I'm sticking with Chthulu/Dagon. At least they are open about their intentions. Evil, diabolical, the antithesis of life itself, but they have the transparency thing down pat.

**SovietDooM** · 10-17-12, 04:44 PM

Because if I'm gonna spend more then 5 minutes throwing a silly picture together, I'm gonna have a little fun with it. And because it was such a shitty movie, you likely didn't catch the poster,

Originally Posted by Alundil

Civil sent me a link to this thread.....

All I have to say on this

Sounds along the lines of what that Green party candidate was screaming when they arrested her.

**~BigTymer~** · 10-17-12, 05:15 PM

Originally Posted by Morningfrost

Not according to the fact checkers I've seen. I saw one "False" rating attached to Obama's comments, and that was when he was talking about how Romney said the Arizona law was a "model for the nation."

~Morningfrost

OBAMA: "Let's take the money that we've been spending on war over the last decade to rebuild America, roads, bridges, schools. We do those things, not only is your future going to be bright, but America's future is going to be bright as well."
THE FACTS: What Obama didn't mention is that much of the money that has been paying for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan was borrowed. In fact, the government borrows nearly 40 cents for every dollar it spends. Thus, using money that had been earmarked for wars to build schools and infrastructure would involve even more borrowing, adding to the federal deficit.

ROMNEY: "As a matter of fact, oil production is down 14 percent this year on federal land, and gas production was down 9 percent. Why? Because the president cut in half the number of licenses and permits for drilling on federal lands and in federal waters."
OBAMA: "Very little of what Governor Romney just said is true. We've opened up public lands. We're actually drilling more on public lands than in the previous administration and my - the previous president was an oilman."
OBAMA: "Very little of what Governor Romney just said is true. We've opened up public lands. We're actually drilling more on public lands than in the previous administration and my - the previous president was an oilman."
According to an Energy Department study published in the spring, sales of oil from federal areas fell 14 percent between 2010 and 2011 and sales of natural gas production fell 9 percent, supporting Romney's point.

OBAMA: "For young people who've come here, brought here oftentimes by their parents, have gone to school here, pledged allegiance to the flag, think of this as their country and understand themselves as Americans in every way except having papers, we should make sure we give them a pathway to citizenship. And that's what I've done administratively."
THE FACTS: His administrative actions do not provide a pathway to citizenship. The administration is allowing as many as 1.7 million young illegal immigrants to apply to avoid deportation for up to two years and get a work permit. And the government has begun a policy of prosecutorial discretion under which illegal immigrants with longstanding ties to the U.S. and no criminal history are generally not arrested and deported by immigration authorities. But these steps do not extend legal status or a process resulting in citizenship.

OBAMA: "And what I want to do is build on the 5 million jobs that we've created over the last 30 months in the private sector alone."
THE FACTS: As he has done before, Obama is cherry-picking his numbers to make them sound better than they really are. He ignores the fact that public-sector job losses have dragged down overall job creation. Also, he chooses just to mention the past 30 months. That ignores job losses during his presidency up until that point. According to the Labor Department, about 4.5 million total jobs have been created over the past 30 months. But some 4.3 million jobs were lost during the earlier months of his administration. At this point, Obama is a net job creator, but only marginally.

OBAMA: "What I've also said is, for (those earning) above $250,000, we can go back to the tax rates we had when Bill Clinton was president."
THE FACTS: Not exactly. The Bush tax cuts set the top income rate at 35 percent. Under Obama's proposal to raise taxes on households earning more than $250,000, the president would return the top rate to the 39.6 percent set during the Clinton administration. But he neglected to mention that his health care law includes a new 0.9 percent Medicare surcharge on households earning over that amount - and that tax would be retained. The health care law also imposes a 3.8 percent tax on investment income for high earners. So tax rates would be higher for the wealthiest Americans than they were under Clinton.

FACT CHECK: Stumbles in latest presidential debate - Local News - Clarksburg, WV | NBC News I only brought up the parts about Obama because you said one

**digital** · 10-17-12, 05:44 PM

And Libya. Plus I like the zinger from Obama how Romney has a 1 point plan when it comes to updating the tax code. That was awesome.

Sent from my Motorola Photon Cannon!

**WickedTribe** · 10-17-12, 05:45 PM

Originally Posted by ~BigTymer~

OBAMA: "Let's take the money that we've been spending on war over the last decade to rebuild America, roads, bridges, schools. We do those things, not only is your future going to be bright, but America's future is going to be bright as well."
THE FACTS: What Obama didn't mention is that much of the money that has been paying for the wars in Iraq and Afghanistan was borrowed. In fact, the government borrows nearly 40 cents for every dollar it spends. Thus, using money that had been earmarked for wars to build schools and infrastructure would involve even more borrowing, adding to the federal deficit.

Not more, the same, or less. Maybe Obama's school and infrastructure will require less money than Bush's wars, and he won't have to borrow as much as Bush did. Either way, it's for a better cause. Either way, nothing in here is factually incorrect.

ROMNEY: "As a matter of fact, oil production is down 14 percent this year on federal land, and gas production was down 9 percent. Why? Because the president cut in half the number of licenses and permits for drilling on federal lands and in federal waters."
OBAMA: "Very little of what Governor Romney just said is true. We've opened up public lands. We're actually drilling more on public lands than in the previous administration and my - the previous president was an oilman."
OBAMA: "Very little of what Governor Romney just said is true. We've opened up public lands. We're actually drilling more on public lands than in the previous administration and my - the previous president was an oilman."
According to an Energy Department study published in the spring, sales of oil from federal areas fell 14 percent between 2010 and 2011 and sales of natural gas production fell 9 percent, supporting Romney's point.

Romney cherry picked one low year to make the number seem low. While it's technically accurate, it's very dishonest.
PolitiFact | Mitt Romney says 'oil production is down 14 percent this year on federal land'
[quote]• From 2004-08, well into Bush’s tenure, oil production on federal lands and waters fell in four of five years, for a net decrease of 16.8 percent.

• From 2009-11, the Obama years, oil production rose two of three years, for a net increase of 10.6 percent.[quote]

[quote]

**deathgodusmc** · 10-17-12, 05:46 PM

Meh they both cherry picked the numbers they wanted to use.

**Morningfrost** · 10-17-12, 05:49 PM

The site I tend to use (Politifact.com) distinguishes between true, mostly-true, half-true, false, etc. You'll noticed I also mentioned he had a "half-true" amongst others. They've since updated the article (http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...n-hall-debate/) to include a few more things. They rate his claims about 5 million new jobs as "half-true", because of the cherry picking you mentioned. The number they came up with was 3.6 million since the beginning of the recovery.

The one I take issue with the most though, is the one about oil production. It's only down in the most recent year recorded (from '10-'11). It was up the other 2 years of Obama's presidency, with a net rise in oil production (of 10.6%) even considering the down year of 13.8% (which gets rounded to 14%).

~Morningfrost

**deathgodusmc** · 10-17-12, 05:49 PM

Personally i liked it when romney told obama he wasn't asking a question but making a statement. I think i liked that one because its what i tell people.