Thread: Just a simple question:

Originally Posted by Fovezer

I'm sorry, but this is pure idiocy. If I didn't know you any better, I'd honestly assume you were just being one of those attention-whore trolls who says the most idiotic things they can think of to antagonize people and start arguments. But this is probably worse, because you're serious!

You haven't made a coherent argument at all this whole thread. There is no point to your madness. At all. You are railing against "moochers" on the dole who are taking your money and you want to start taking away rights, yet you haven't even defined what constitutes a "moocher" in your view. What is really happening is you are dehumanizing a group people you don't like, and quite frankly, it's disgusting. To you, these "things" aren't people at all and as such, are not worthy of the same rights as you or I. I just can't wrap my mind around being that hateful and resentful of other people. Even for groups of people I do not like, I would NEVER advocate taking away a right from them. Where does it end with control freaks like you? Oh no, someone said something that offended you! Gotta outlaw that, too!

And where the hell are you getting this idea that everyone on government assistance doesn't work at all? Are you really that naive? Also, you do realize that most people on assistance have little education and cannot find anything better than minimum wage jobs, if that? That doesn't always pay all the bills. And I don't see you blaming companies like Walmart for intentionally keeping employees underemployed so they don't have to pay benefits and force their own employees onto government aid. But no, that'd mean you actually have to think about the question you proposed, but trolls don't do that. You just throw shit out there to see what sticks. You were never interested in a real discussion about government assistance.

Which is why I tried to cut this shit off long ago. But it evolved right... Into more shit.

Sent from my Desire HD using Tapatalk 2

Originally Posted by Hitch

Oh, did I say all that? No. You are projecting. I won't regress to name calling, as you have. Also, you do not know me. You have not walked/limped in my shoes. You do not know to what extent I am handicapped. You do not know that I have been putting 3-4 operations off due to the FACT that I have to work or my money stops. You do not know a damn thing, boy. I own a business that is physical and outdoors. It gets hot in the summer and guess what The winter is not too damn tropical either. You assume that people on the dole are all incapable of bettering themselves without help. Bullshit. They can reproduce based-on what they can afford, they can persue material goods less, they can dope less and they can quit being apart of an institution that has become rampant. You are swallowing thier tears.

No, no projection. That's exactly what you said. You never refer to them as people, you've always referred to them as "moochers" and other derogatory terms. You lump them all together and make no effort to take situations into account. Saying "they can reproduce based on what they can afford" and that they can "dope less" is beyond idiotic. I have no other words for that, and it's not meant to be name-calling. It is what it is. You're implying that all of them are promiscuous drug addicts, and you say you aren't dehumanizing them? Really? Don't be dense, that's exactly what you're doing!

Sure, they could have reproduced less, but guess what? They didn't. Now what? You want to punish the children for the irresponsibility of the parents? Why? Are you intentionally trying to perpetuate this cycle or make it worse? Because you sure as hell aren't trying to fix it.

Originally Posted by Hitch

I do believe that people on the dole should have limited opinions/representation(while on assistance) due to obvious facts: they can vote on things which benefit them...at no cost to THEM. How is that so cruel? No shit, they want a "ride". Some of them need it, however, not all of them do. I am NOT talking about persons who paid into our systems for a bulk of thier working lives. Of course there are people who get mamed at work or while doing dangerous hobbies, I HOPE THEY CHOOSE to buy insurance. A line needs to be established; it sure as hell is not the gig that is up right now!

Yeah, I'm not going to get behind your desire to strip rights from people because you don't like them or how they vote. I know conservatives nowadays are really getting behind the voter suppression thing, but even then most aren't trying to ban people from voting, just making it unnecessarily more complicated. You want to actually take away a right, and that's beyond reprehensible.

Originally Posted by Hitch

I have PERSONALLY witnessed cases of people on the scratch that have cash-based businesses and they are skipping taxes. If all earned-income was taxed correctly, our nation's situation would be improved. When have you ever heard of a homeowner giving a 10-99 to the person who mows thier lawn? Never, I bet. That money should be taxed, based on our laws. The "can you cut me a deal" and "come back on your personal time so I do not have to pay your employer's rates" has to stop too.

When people cash contract-pay-checks at locations designed for such (check cashing specialists), how much tax do you think is actually collected? None for SS. None that resemble what is pulled from your paycheck if you happen to have a legitamate employer or run a clean business. Don't forget, money that is transfered at the next window (Western Union, for example), goes to Mexico, Honduras...etc. That money leaves our system, taxlessly. It won't be spent at your dad's convenient store or anywhere else in the US.

Wow. Money from mowing lawns is sure going to solve this national debt crisis. Gee, that $10 I got for mowing a lawn as a kid would have probably paid down the debt by now! As for money leaving the country untaxed, wasn't there a recent presidential candidate who kept untaxed money in the Cayman Islands? Yeah, but it's all the Mexicans' fault.

But this is about cheating the tax system, not about government assistance. Guess what, the biggest tax cheats are those on the top, not those on the bottom. As I said before, you have no rhyme or reason to your rant. There is no coherent point to any of this.

Originally Posted by Hitch

As for WalMart, I would be fine if they dissolved entirely. WalMart and the other huge mega stores have been choking small businesses for decades. Where do I support a corporation running anything, as you stated? You are in need of some education.

At least we agree on something. But why aren't you blaming Walmart, among others, in your rant for providing extremely subpar wages and hours and forcing people onto assistance?

Originally Posted by Hitch

I never said that people on the DOLE are completely not working. Be aware, however, that you are not so well-informed as to tell me that all persons on the dole need to be there...semi-subsidized or not. Call a social worker in south Texas and ask them to give you a no-holds-barred brain dump. It is simply REVOLTING how many Mexicans cross the border and collect US benefits, cash them, grocery shop, ect... and then truck it back across. I have seen it with my own eyes. You sir, have obviously NOT.

And the truth finally comes out. I knew it was only a matter of time. I know people like you, trust me. It's always the minorities fault. Where I live, those people tend to blame a different minority, though.

Originally Posted by Hitch

Do you really think our government is not out of control? Growing/spending beyond measure in support of BULLSHIT programs? Get real. I paid my way through college and so the hell should anybody else who wants to get an education that is advanced. I took out not ONE single loan to do it. I worked and my parents did help some (less than 50%). I qualified for loans, however, I did not want to owe anybody a damn thing; hence I was in school for 5 years.

Fiscal irresponsibility is no doubt a problem in our government. They love to cut taxes and increase spending. Reaganomics it a terrible, terrible fiscal policy. Look at defense spending. It's insanely out of control and needs to be reigned in. And I really don't give a shit how you paid your way through school. I did the same damn thing. I had to take loans, though, but I worked throughout and was able to keep them in check. I don't owe all that much anymore. That said, I STILL support universal subsidized college education. You want people to go out and get good paying jobs when they can't afford to go to school to get an advanced degree? Have you completely lost touch with reality or what?

Look, there are no doubt going to be people who take advantage of the system. That's a given. It's going to happen. What I don't like, and will not accept, is blaming everyone for the faults of a few. You want to find a way to go after those people abusing it? Fine, make a proposal. I can discuss that. Make wide, sweeping claims based on laughably absurd stereotypes in order to dehumanize and strip away rights? I'm not even going to consider taking you seriously for a minute.

Deep breath.........

This thread can continue to get emotional and this gets locked and someone(s) take a break.....or this gets back on track and in a quickness.

...and exhale

Hitch - tread lightly as this thread almost didn't survive the first few short ridiculous seconds of its life (and by "almost didn't" I mean that in the most literal example of "sliver" or "skin of its teeth").

Originally Posted by DJ Mr. White

I just want to pet her.

Man if i only knew how many females i have thought that same damn thing.

I'll tell you one that usually gets a little laugh from them. Take a look while they see it and when you turn your head back forward just say yup im going to hell for that one. Its been a pretty good conversation starter for me in the past.

Originally Posted by Hitch

I will skip the cut n quote bullcrap. That is a load and you full well know it.

We can't all have jobs based-on higher education. The whole US cannot be highly educated. The lawn mowing remark was a simple example for you to feed on...duh. I was referring to the guys who do check-only contracting (lawn/landscaping, home improvement, you name it) because it DOES add up that they are screwing our tax system. Sure, they pale in comparison to a multitude of real wealth hoarders, but they are part of the problem.

You can't really believe that everybody aspires to be at whatever level you aspire to... do you? Somebody has to take out the damn trash. Get real. There are plenty of people who are not even trying to get jobs due to unemployment extensions.

Now we are getting somewhere because the inconsistencies in your argument are coming to light. If everyone cannot have a job based on higher education, which I agree with, how do you propose these people survive while working minimum wage jobs? How are unskilled laborers supposed to get a liveable wage? Would you support a mandatory liveable wage instead of a minimum wage? If only there was some way for workers to organize and bargain for wages and benefits collectively? Oh, but according to people like you, unions are the devil! Those people don't "deserve" higher wages, they deserve the lower wages that cannot sustain their family, which forces them on government assistance. Good plan!

Originally Posted by Hitch

When I got laid off, I went and got picked out in the same labor lines as the ... yup ... Mexican laborers. My degree did not keep my head up so high that I refused to do work that was not requiring my education. My points have been made, your judgements have been noted. I doubt I'll ever have an ounce of respect for you or your "profound" way of repeating the libical talking points. I'm conservative, sure; however not a Republican. The people you refer to at the "top" are of both parties and laughing thier asses off at all the end-fighting at our levels. They go unscathed. If we tax them more, they leave with whatever jobs/products etc...they provide.

Keep punbishing the rich. Keep being envious of what some of them actually earned. You'll always be a bitter, down-trodden victim, huh?

More rambling. This whole discussion was about those on government assistance, no one said anything about "punishing the rich." Having this conversation with you is like watching a train derail. Everything going up in flames all over the place. That whole "the rich are job creators" myth has been thoroughly debunked here, too, so I have no idea why you feel the need to worship the wealthy as if they are benevolent job-giving gods.

Originally Posted by Hitch

When was the last time you did anything for charity? Donate time, money or resources? I'm asking out of curiosity. My family donates mainly to animal protective causes. Some money to law enforcement, troops' family funds and I help little old ladies to cross a street from time to time. I donate nothing to political causes because both major parties sicken me to the point of loose bowels.

So you don't think these people should get government aid, and I presume you feel they should rely on the charity of others, yet you don't actually donate to any programs that would help these people? Once again, all talk but no solutions.