National ID cards

**MotoZ** · 04-25-08, 01:15 AM

Originally Posted by Rooster050

Some choose to take it to the next level....

What is "it"?

**rock_lobster** · 04-25-08, 02:17 AM

Well, I was going to say that a national ID card that was optional would be ok with me, but that kind of negates the goal of using them for anti-terrorism. There are other uses for it though, some of which I am not opposed to. I don't think anything like this should be mandatory.

**marmaduke1971** · 04-25-08, 08:09 AM

Originally Posted by ebaconjr

Originally Posted by marmaduke1971

ebaconjr, what laws do you support ? You might want to list them. . .

The U.S. Constitution and all the laws that have formed under it.

Below is a link to our Constitution:
http://www.law.cornell.edu/constitution/

Yes, the U.S. Contitution is nice, but do you trust your most hated enemy to administer it for you ? That was my real question.

Marm

**sjt17** · 04-25-08, 08:37 AM

I believe the scenario that turns us into big brother/brave new world has already happened and continues to happen, and evolve behind the scenes, but I don't see the end, in my head, I don't know that things will swing all the way (even long term) to Orwell or Huxley.

The RFID is probably unavoidable, and can be argued it's just an extension of your current drivers license or credit card as others have done in this thread, in it's self it's revolutionary as it makes information gathering so much easier - as the the telephone did.....as the internet does, as magnetic strips and GPS do.

My dream for the future is that consumer/citizens are given the authority, power and control over their personal information. Meaning the way the credit score system, medical records etc... are handled as respects privacy and personal control - are revamped.

Power must be returned to us to control our private information, we have to fight to empower our selves to have control over our identities just as we would have fought to have control over our 100 acres assigned to us in Oklahoma 150 years ago.

Do we have an absolute right to privacy?

Do we have the ability to control and keep private (including from the government) our personal information, travel habits, purchasing trends, medical records, GENOME

?

Are we the "be all end all" when it comes to our privacy and records.

If we answer yes to that, the RFID and the things that follow it that will be even more innovative will be on the right path to expansion of society + human kind vs. control of society + human kind.

To me, it's not the RFID chip that's at ALL an issue...it's how hard we fight to control the potential impact to our privacy that the RFID and the sure to come expansions of this type of technology provide...

**Rooster050** · 05-02-08, 11:25 AM

Originally Posted by ebaconjr

Originally Posted by Rooster050

Some choose to take it to the next level....

What is "it"?

it is Verichip. Watch the video. Implantable RFID tags with your information

**MotoZ** · 05-02-08, 01:49 PM

Originally Posted by marmaduke1971

Yes, the U.S. Contitution is nice, but do you trust your most hated enemy to administer it for you ? That was my real question.

Marm

I do. G Dubbya's administrative branch up until about a year ago included the most evil cast of characters that I could imagine holding such esteemed offices. I hated them, and still hate Bush despite having voted for him. But yet I trust the Consitution's framework to get issues like our foreign policy, personal freedoms, and government transparency off the guard rail. The Bush administrative branch took every law they came across and wrecked them past their limits of elasticity. They are paying for breaking shit by losing power in the legislative branch and losing trials in the judical branch. The checks and balances of the Consitution are working.

As far as I understand the RFID law, it has no check or balances, or worse yet, no limitations on what types of infomration can be tied to the ID. Was that by accident? I don't think so. There are some pretty bright Yale and Harvard boys that write and/or review that shit. They don't miss anything. If a newb lawyer like me on TTP can figure out the loopholes then you can bet that they are there on purpose.

**WileECyte** · 05-02-08, 02:51 PM

Originally Posted by nsRaven

If you're afraid of identity theft, remember that nothing is unhackable. I know that doesn't give you warm and fuzzies, but hey, its true. Also keep in mind that all of your personal and financial information is online somewhere, readily accessible to anyone who dares to hack into it. Think about how many times you give your credit card to someone to pay a bill at a restaurant or whatever. Do you have any idea how easy it is for someone to just write down the card number, expiration date, verification code, and your name...everything needed to charge that card online? Happened to me. Keep in mind that sometimes the receipts generated don't block out the entire card number either, another easy target. People can also create checks with their name on it using your bank's routing number and your bank account number. Happened to my parents. I guarantee you that right now, some old person in Florida is sending their personal and banking information to some "investment banker" in Nigeria.

Raven,

If you ever receive a receipt where your entire credit card number is on it, that store/company is in violation of the Payment Card Industry Data Security Standard (PCI DSS) and subject to rather significant fines. A bigger risk is them swiping your card through a card reader of their own and gathering the data contained on that stripe. They can then sell this data and a new physical card can be created for use/abuse by whomever it is sold to.

There's fairly well documented information out there about the 'security' or lack thereof of the RFID being used in passports. You can buy an RFID Experimentation kit from thinkgeek.com and with information gathered on the internet are able to read the data contained within the passport RFID chip. Now there is an interesting way to get the old style non-RFID chip passports issued to you. Go to a third-world country and lose your passport. You then just need to go to the Embassy/Counsulate for that country and they'll issue the old style passports. The problem is they haven't gotten the new RFID capable equipment to the smaller nations of the world. I'm sure that loophole will be gone soon enough.

The credit cards that your banks and financial institutions are issuing with RFID chips in them are subject to the same problem. They can be read by a device about the size of a lunch box from a range of 20-50 feet. A criminal wanting to steal your credit card info would need to setup shop near any of the point of sale terminals in a store with his little device and your data is as good as gone. You can request a card from MOST banks and financial institutions that does not have RFID chips in them. I've done this with a couple of my accounts.

My wife and I are going on a cruise... we need passports in order to board the ship. Rather than disable the RFID chip (and invalidate the passport) we opted to get an RFID blocking wallet to store our passports in.

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