Thread: "balance" complaints...

(this will be mainly towards the BF series )

"balance" complaints on things that are inherently imbalanced!

jets/choppers-
really? jets/choppers are overpowered? no chit, that's what they are designed to be...they are supposed to deliver maximum maim and damage to the battlefield. jets fly at high speeds, with nasty guns and big bombs...their sole purpose is absolute destruction. they are supposed to be overpowered. do I think some programming should be implemented? yes. for instance in the case of jets...

-no, single pass, full re-arm at the runway...either have to slow down considerably and/or make multiple passes, or even have to land to re-arm
-reduce hit damage to 1 or 2 missiles max, and damage from small arms...after all, jets are, as noted in another thread, fragile vehicles
-infantry carried/mounted AA...with stipulations: limited kit/pick-up; and/or it has to be deployed/setup before firing (ie, no firing on the fly/from the hip such as a BF2 AT)
-turn off the auto targeting for ground vehicles (ie, bomb mode), and implement "manual" targeting/lasering for such instances

choppers...c'mon, they have 2 sets of eyes (gunner+pilot), a big-ass chain gun, hellfires and hydros...all part of a highly maneuverable destruction machine. and as above, in the case of choppers, I really have only one change in programming...

-damage. when I hit a chopper with a rocket or missile, that biatch should go down.

do I fault them for being overpowered? no. am I going to stop playing a game with the depth and diversity that BF2 has because I get bombed or gunned down by aircraft a few times in a row? hell no. am I going to try to adapt and counter? hell yes. instead of driving down that open road lit up for the jet, I'm going to take that back road and/or use the terrain and cover to my advantage...that doesn't work, I'll just hoof it. Heck, I might even try my hand at flying and learn to fight fire with fire, God forbid.


class imbalances...ok, I admit, this one is what ultimately triggered this post. It's up to using teamwork and diversity to create that balance and cohesion...not to dumb down and consolidate the classes where everyone has all the same tools/weapons...if that's the case/goal, then all you have is deathmatch. in regard to the BC2/BF3 class comments: "the medic class isn't offensive enough as it is"...really? the medic is a supportive class, not on offensive class...at best, should be a more defensive role in order to keep themselves and their squadmates alive. Assault class should be the primary...assaulting...class, not medic. a medic should not be equipped with a LMG...that should be delegated to a support gunner. the medic should be equipped with an SMG, or at best a "light" battle rifle/carbine. similarly, an engineer should provide close support to armor, and as such an AT should counter that armor combo...not both mashed into one generalized armor support/destroy class. the one consolidation I would consider is the sniper/specops classes, as they are both dependent on stealth. learn to use teamwork and adaptability to balance classes...not dumb down and consolidate the classes, otherwise you may as well play CoD and/or deathmatch.

people are always quick to complain about the "horribly overpowered" aircraft in BF2 (things that are inherently overpowered mind you), yet just about everyone plays and/or depends on the one truly overpowered and imbalanced thing in BF2: the medic, particularly one equipped with the G36E. the G36E is the most imbalanced thing in all of BF2...it may as well be a laser...how a weapon with practically the same specs and rounds as the other assault rifles was programmed to be so lethal in comparison is beyond me...yet people complain about aircraft, of which are typically 2-4 per team (barring asset stealing), whereas you can have a team full of G36E wielding medics, who have the ability to distribute unlimited health and insta-full health revives with with rifles that can take a target down in usually 1-2 bursts...

if anyone is interested in the best class balance implementations to date (imo of course), try BF2:PR and/or TF2...every class has its proper role in the game...where one is "deficient/imbalanced", there is another class that is there to support and fill in that deficiency/imbalance, and vice versa...assuming teamwork and cohesion is used to mesh all the pieces of the puzzle together...


</ramblin' rant>

Don't be hating my G36E brother!! =P

If anything the jets and choppers are dumbed down for bf2. In real life you get more then one chance to pop flares in an air battle or running from aa. If they fail you get chaff. Jets in real life tell you when to drop your weapons now for your current rate of speed and angle. Where it's unealistic is guns. The vulcan cannon has 2 rates of speed low 3000 rpm high 6000 rpm. It holds a total of 555 rounds. Do the math and see how many seconds you should be able to fire verses what you have in game. Now lets discuss the bombs for just a second. How many times have we all been in a fast mover and a bomb drop killed all but 1 person and the vehcile? To many and there is nothing reastic about that happening.

The choppers are way less accurate/damaging in game verses real life. We'll start with the hellfires first. This round does not have to hit shit. It only has to get close and what it was is dead. They carry 2 different size rockets 3.5 and 5 inch. Seeing as you only have 8 shots on a full load they went realistic with 5 in rockets. Well it only takes 2 hits to knock out just about anything with a 5 in rocket. The cobra has the same vulcan cannon that every jet in bf2 carrys the only difference is it has 3 barrels instead of 6. It fires at 3000 rpm with about 700 rounds at its disposal.

Now if they want to really get realistic you make these guns jam when pilots are trying to john wayne them lie it does in real life. In the end its a game and we could pick every piece of it apart if we wanted to or we can be content in the fact that someone put the effort into something like this for us to play.

yes, I may have played an online game or two in my time and know that it comes with the territory

see, my point made about aircraft made in 2 replies...they are inherently overpowered in "real life", and are considerably nerfed back, relatively speaking, in lieu of the gaming environment..."the normally overpowered thing that is already greatly handicapped and nerfed is too overpowered!". if the game was realistic, bombs would have a little more splash damage than the 20m radius they have now, or that 7.62 pkm support gunner would clean up a whole area with one sweep, instead of that medic with 2 bursts per target with their 5.56... (well, 'realistically' realistically either would be lethal...but from a tech spec perspective... )

anyhoo, the part about aircraft was mainly a side-bar that I included in the general topic...my main motivation for this post revolved around all the class balance/consolidation posts concerning BC2/BF3...such as a medic with an LMG, or a medic not being offensive enough, or if two different classes are/are not balanced to each other, etc... I mean, that's the whole point of using teamwork and adaptation to situationally (is that a word?) balance those imbalances...otherwise it may as well be team deathmatch...

just imagine if everyone had the same abilities and weapons in TF2. Or if all football players were the same in size, stature and ability.



oh, and 'french-canadians'...pft.