Apple Pay Live Today

**dex71** · 10-20-14, 04:48 PM

Anyone give a shit?

Apple Pay launches with few hiccups

I don't. At least about the Apple branded pay service. At best, I'll wait until the Android whateveritsgonnabecalled, and maybe try that. It would be for security reasons, as the magnetic strip has proved to be unsecure (insecure?). It would have nothing to do with getting rid of, or replacing my wallet.......because that's just silly. I carry more than just debit/credit cards in my wallet, and am required to carry some cards (dl, wiring license, access cards to a few businesses, business cards, ect).

**AetheLove** · 10-20-14, 05:40 PM

Originally Posted by dex71

Anyone give a shit?

Apple Pay launches with few hiccups

I don't. At least about the Apple branded pay service. At best, I'll wait until the Android whateveritsgonnabecalled, and maybe try that. It would be for security reasons, as the magnetic strip has proved to be unsecure (insecure?). It would have nothing to do with getting rid of, or replacing my wallet.......because that's just silly. I carry more than just debit/credit cards in my wallet, and am required to carry some cards (dl, wiring license, access cards to a few businesses, business cards, ect).

I do.

I'm really interested in how it works out. It's the first system from a major player that I think has potential to not suck.

I've looked at the basics of their security and information model. There is a lot to like about it, in particular the extent to which it isn't passing around a lot of info.

The merchant gets paid, but doesn't get the details of the payment account (they don't know, and can't steal, your credit card info).

Apple facilitates the transfer, but doesn't get to know what you buy. That was particularly impressive to me, as every other system I've heard of attempts to monetize your behaviour by tracking your purchases; basically making themselves into a "shopper's club card" for everything you buy.

The issuing bank still knows what you buy, but you can switch which account you use for any particular purchase. I keep separate accounts for different categories of purchases, but that means carrying extra cards. The Apple Pay system would make it easy for someone to have many more accounts.

I think there are real concerns about how much power and authority gets put into one device, and cracking the security would be a potential disaster. But the authentication tokens are unique and generated per-transaction, so that limits exposure. Also, the purchases are still 'on' a credit card, and whatever fraud protection you had before still applies. The design seems reasonable, though obviously the devil is in the implementation.

We'll see.

It feels a little bit like a foot-in-the-door for Apple. They're simply making the use of your existing cards and accounts easier and more convenient, but there's no reason to think that at some point they might want to strong-arm VISA (or your bank) for a discounted transaction fee (which would be great) or a cut of that action (don't know how to feel about that one).

For about 6 years now, Apple has had an absolute mountain of cash. It keeps growing. People speculate all the time about what Apple should do with all that money. Usually it's about which other companies Apple should buy.

My answer to what Apple should do with something like 100 billion dollars: start a bank.

Cheers,

AetheLove

**SmokenScion** · 10-20-14, 05:46 PM

Originally Posted by AetheLove

I do.

I'm really interested in how it works out. It's the first system from a major player that I think has potential to not suck.

I've looked at the basics of their security and information model. There is a lot to like about it, in particular the extent to which it isn't passing around a lot of info.

The merchant gets paid, but doesn't get the details of the payment account (they don't know, and can't steal, your credit card info).

Apple facilitates the transfer, but doesn't get to know what you buy. That was particularly impressive to me, as every other system I've heard of attempts to monetize your behaviour by tracking your purchases; basically making themselves into a "shopper's club card" for everything you buy.

The issuing bank still knows what you buy, but you can switch which account you use for any particular purchase. I keep separate accounts for different categories of purchases, but that means carrying extra cards. The Apple Pay system would make it easy for someone to have many more accounts.

I think there are real concerns about how much power and authority gets put into one device, and cracking the security would be a potential disaster. But the authentication tokens are unique and generated per-transaction, so that limits exposure. Also, the purchases are still 'on' a credit card, and whatever fraud protection you had before still applies. The design seems reasonable, though obviously the devil is in the implementation.

We'll see.

It feels a little bit like a foot-in-the-door for Apple. They're simply making the use of your existing cards and accounts easier and more convenient, but there's no reason to think that at some point they might want to strong-arm VISA (or your bank) for a discounted transaction fee (which would be great) or a cut of that action (don't know how to feel about that one).

For about 6 years now, Apple has had an absolute mountain of cash. It keeps growing. People speculate all the time about what Apple should do with all that money. Usually it's about which other companies Apple should buy.

My answer to what Apple should do with something like 100 billion dollars: start a bank.

Cheers,

AetheLove

TL: DR AeTh uses Bitcoins for Massages.

**Guyver** · 10-20-14, 05:49 PM

Fucking meh.

Pulling out your cash/credit card/debit card/check is SO difficult....but paying with Iphone 6 is so much easier? How?

Geez...

**dex71** · 10-20-14, 05:57 PM

The timing of it is about as perfect as it could be, which is why I am interested. The days of the magnetic strip are almost over, as it is probably less secure than wearing your CC info printed on your shirt. Every retailer in the country is looking for a better way.

This won't sell me an iphone, but the tech behind it may very well catch on and go mainstream very quickly. I know there is something similar in the works for Android.

The walletless ad campaign is silly pants, though. If I were marketing director, I'd be focusing on security as my major angle. Pay by phone just might be the exact right thing at the exact right time.

**dex71** · 10-20-14, 06:00 PM

Originally Posted by Guyver

Fucking meh.

Pulling out your cash/credit card/debit card/check is SO difficult....but paying with Iphone 6 is so much easier? How?

Geez...

I agree.....but it's so much more than just getting rid of the .00000412 ounces of plastic in your wallet. It's about getting rid of the magnetic strip that has proven to be easily stolen. The Target security breach (among others)would have never happened without the magnetic strip.

**AetheLove** · 10-20-14, 06:10 PM

Originally Posted by SmokenScion

TL: DR AeTh uses Bitcoins for Massages.

I don't own any Bitcoin or similar currencies. I'm not against it, I just haven't bothered yet.

I know there are potentially huge upsides for early adopters, but I've got my speculative money elsewhere.

Every time you give your account info to someone, you expose that account. Discounting actual fraud, there are dozens of scenarios where that gets abused.

You can keep an extra checking account (debit card account) with a minimal balance that you use for one-time purchases. Just transfer enough money to cover the purchases before you make them. You get the convenience of a card transaction, with zero exposure to your 'real' bank accounts or credit card.

Originally Posted by Guyver

Fucking meh.

Pulling out your cash/credit card/debit card/check is SO difficult....but paying with Iphone 6 is so much easier? How?

Geez...

Are you serious? You can't think of any upside?

a thinner wallet
less at stake if you lose your wallet (leave your cards at home)
no exposure of your account details to the merchant
no receipt to print
no signature required

There are more, but I'll let others contribute.

Also... "Fucking meh" ?!?

You can't have an emphatic 'meh'. If something doesn't even raise your interest, how can it raise your passion?

Æ

**Guyver** · 10-20-14, 06:32 PM

Yeah, because a receipt and signature are soooo cumbersome. Less at stake??..lol. Apple has access to every transaction, if they say they don't they're full of shit. A thinner wallet? What are you carrying...a boat for a wallet?

A year or two from now, when all that info is stolen, people will be saying "How could we let this happen?"

Well, dumbshit, you set yourself up for it.

People are too damn lazy about this stuff.

What's next?

"Paying for stuff with my Iphone is too tedious, can't I just blink my eyes and pay?"

**HeavyG** · 10-20-14, 06:46 PM

I am heavily invested in Bitcoin, Litecoin, Dogecoin and Darkcoin. I even own quite a bit of some other "altcoins", like Syscoin, Umbrellacoin, Tacocoin (yes... Tacocoin), and Greencoin.

My heaviest position is within Bitcoin, followed closely by Litecoin, as that is what I was primarily mining for about 5 months straight. I recently started merge-mining Dogecoin through a pool (SimpleMulti - Home - A custom Multicoin mining pool with no registration). I don't have a lot of mining equipment anymore as I conveted over to leasing cloud mining space. The fees are higher than if I was mining with my own equipment/electricity, but I enjoy the fact that I don't have to worry about it. Kind of like how we choose to lease our game servers vs. owning them here at TPG.

If I would have sold all of my coins as I mined them, I would be much better off in terms of USD, but I just didn't need the money, so I have held on to every single coin I mined or traded hoping that one of them eventually take off.

I like Cryptocurrencies, but they aren't perfect. There are some things that I really like about specific coins, how they can benefit businesses, but also the validation to prevent counterfeit transactions. Bitcoin may end up being the standard because of the aggressive position taken by venture capitalists, but in terms of it's functionality, there are much better coins out there.

What really interests me is that when Bitcoin is mined up, there will be roughly a 60,000:1 ratio of USD to Bitcoin. Scarcity is a factor as eventually no new Bitcoins will ever be created. Do I think they will be worth $60k? No. But long term, I firmly believe they will be worth multiple times the current $400/coin today. Heck, if 3 years from now they are worth a few grand, I will be retiring young.