Thread: de_port

Quoted from the CSS Rules and Policies post by ...bigdog...:

#3. Pursue your objective, or die trying.
There is no such thing as camping for a defending team. They must guard the objective, and if the objective doesn't move, there's no reason to think that the defenders MUST move to protect it. HOWEVER, there is quite a disease in CS, in which the offending team (bomb-carrying terrorists or hostage-rescuing CT's) does little to pursue their objective. The best examples would be on dust, or italy, where frequently, offending teams will simply wait out the clock near their spawns, hoping to draw out curious members of the defending team. This is camping. Pure and simple. If you wish to camp, do so on a DEFENDING team.

The server has implemented measures to discourage offensive players from camping. These measures apply to the CT's on a hostage map and to the T's on a bombing map. These measures are fully automated, and thus unbiased. The bomb is displayed on your radar, as are the hostages, so there can be no excuses for disregarding the objective. The round timer is also displayed, and exists for a reason. If you are unwilling, or incapable of completing your objective in the time allotted, you will be punished, harshly.

In addition, if you are consistently camping, promoting camping, and losing while camping on an offending team, expect to be punished further. The admin will take notice immediately when outbreaks of unjustified camping occur, and may supercede the automated punishments at any time for something more "appropriate", up to and including kicks or bans. Though we are reluctant to punish any one player for doing as his team does, we will identify and persecute the chief campers quickly, and move down the ladder from there.

Keep in mind, we are NOT asking you to run off into your deaths. But we ARE asking you to play CS. This is not Quake. This is not Doom. This is not Unreal. If you want to stand around and shoot at things, I'm sure there's a “fight yard" map open somewhere out there for you to sit around on.

This is Counter-Strike. There has to be an objective, and a means to take it or defend it. Otherwise, it's not CS. It's just a DM where you don't respawn.

With that being posted, I think it's important to show that, yes, the T's CAN plant the bomb on the boat while there is a sniper from the silos. Just as we fooled the CT's on de_aztec by using smoke, so too, could the T's on de_port. Two or three smokes, at minimum, on the boat, would obstruct any view of the sniper on silos until the bomb got planted. After that, it is HIS objective to try and get to the bomb to defuse it. He's gotta get off the damned silo and help his team defuse the bomb.

Which brings me to point two:

"Well, he can stay up on the silos, he's helping pick off any T's in the area so that the CTs can move in [and defuse]."

Well, if that is the case, and if that is true, then having 2 T's camp spawn ramp and picking off the CT's on silos is ABSOLUTELY allowed, IMHO. "Well, he can stay up on the silos spawn ramp, he's helping pick off any T's CT's in the area on the silos so that the CT's T's can move in [and plant].

Further, I can see how it might take a T more than 8 or 10 seconds to pick off the guy at silo. You know how CT's rotate to the boat....the go the long way around the silos, going through T spawn. They go through mid, by T entrance to warehouse. They've got CT's they've got to worry about (immediate threat sort of thing). However, I can't say that sticking two snipers on T Ramp every round is beneficial to the team, since, more or less, it's always the same two snipers.

As ...bigdog... said in the rules, "HOWEVER, there is quite a disease in CS, in which the offending team (bomb-carrying terrorists or hostage-rescuing CT's) does little to pursue their objective. " However, I think the sniping T's are doing their job and absolutely pursuing their objective in this instance. They are not "waiting out" the T's, they are providing suppresive/cover fire.

Use them smokes, use them to your advantage. If you have to stick two T's in T ramp every time you boat rush, you're not doing it right. However, IMHO, I really see nothing wrong with a T staying back at ramp during a boat rush every so often, given that he coordinates with his team and his team approves it.

Port is just a very icky map when it comes to sniper camping. Its so open with so many lanes to shoot down that it becomes easy to justify camping on T ramp or CT spawn or on silos. For me bottom line when sniping is this. On T side I stop on ramp and take one or two shots at CT's then follow in the back of the rush (face it rushing T with scout is no good up front) If t's went boat I cover by T crates or on boat. If T's went Silo's I cover back corner's and bomb. Basically you don't have to camp, just move with the team and then cover. If I'm CT side sniping I may jump up on the hill and snipe a T or so, but I also call where the T team is going, then move there myself. Picking enemy off on the way.

Being a sniper does not mean being a camper. You just have to learn to adjust your game.

On port many people get confused between whats considered sniper cover and sniper camping. If your on T and the call is a Rush to either side.. the snipers duty (unless told otherwise) its to pop off a shot or 2 down mid.. and then push regardless of if you got a kill or not. You can then help your teamates plant the bomb by sniping any opposing force members from the bombsite area and once the bomb is planted.. can set up to snipe and guard the bomb. On port you CAN kill the CT's sniping from their spawn area and silos via top of the boat... so you could easily rush boat.. get up top.. and snipe from there. In fact.. a scout from the boat is one of the most effective ways to guard the bomb.

Im guessing you simply spent to much time sitting in spawn or to many rounds doing the same thing while your team was losing. If the call is a rush then the ideal situation is for EVERYONE to rush... because every body pushing helps and if your sniping in spawn.. you are getting kills that are much less important than kills by the bomb site to allow a plant. And as Pineapple says.. smokes are your friend in terms of getting out of spawn or getting into a bomb site with less threat from sniper fire.

Im inclined to believe the admin was justified in slaying you based on the fact that on port people often get slayed for excesive spawn camping with a sniper rifle... on both teams. T's when they are supposed to be planting and CT's when they sould be defusing. You should remember that this is a "teamplay" server and sometimes you have to play in a style you think unwise for the good of the team or "teamplay" environment. Win or Lose.. play as a team or dont play at all.

I was only spending a few (about 20) seconds in the T spawn ramp covering. Silos is part of CT spawn they spawn right next to the latter up there. Impossible for a T to make it to boat (with full health, throw a smoke or 2, and then plant the bomb) if a CT is up in the silo sniping. Also the CT sniping make a constant effort to get the bomb into the water.

I was never argueing against the admins rights to do anything, its his powers to use as he/she see fit. im was just saying that it seemed unfair for the T's to snipe them back from their spawn ramp. We always won doing this and it seemed really effective. Again im not trying to get all the admins mad at me for any of this, this is not a abuse thread, just what happened in one game late at night.

Originally Posted by Phantom

I was only spending a few (about 20) seconds in the T spawn ramp covering. Silos is part of CT spawn they spawn right next to the latter up there. Impossible for a T to make it to boat (with full health, throw a smoke or 2, and then plant the bomb) if a CT is up in the silo sniping. Also the CT sniping make a constant effort to get the bomb into the water.

I was never argueing against the admins rights to do anything, its his powers to use as he/she see fit. im was just saying that it seemed unfair for the T's to snipe them back from their spawn ramp. We always won doing this and it seemed really effective. Again im not trying to get all the admins mad at me for any of this, this is not a abuse thread, just what happened in one game late at night.

No worries on that, you're bringing up a legitimate concern man. The admins will continue to administer as they see fit. Here at TTP, EVERYONE gets to have their voice heard.

Now, as far as it being impossible to get to the boat, lay down 2 smokes, and then plant the bomb without being picked off...I'm calling bull. You can smoke the boat almost from T spawn ramp. You can actually smoke the bombsite when you're rounding the T side fence/crates. While the rest of your team [should be] flashing and nading to the right, 2 or 3 others can easily plop a smoke down. One on the ramp, two on the site.

Makin' me wanna play port, son!

Originally Posted by Phantom

Impossible for a T to make it to boat (with full health, throw a smoke or 2, and then plant the bomb) if a CT is up in the silo sniping.

That is simply not true. If a team has good teamwork and knows where to place smokes and flashes.. its very easy to get onto boat and plant the bomb if server CT's are sniping from spawn and silo. It sounds to me like you simply ran into the case of a good CT team that was playing smart and had some good snipers and your team was having some trouble with pushing the boat. Hey it happens... ive been on port before where im on T side and we lose a good 5 people coming out of spawn to a couple of good snipers. But almost every time thats happened its been because we didnt properly smoke or flash to cover our push... or were slow getting out of spawn because people were trying to peak shot the snipers.

if you ask me port is a totally fair map, sure a t can stand back and pick a guy off, but like adretheon you gotta get moving, the point is to plant the bomb, and the rush is going to NEED YOUR HELP too.

if you're having trouble at port as a t, it's because you're not making good enough calls, the boat is not the only way to go.

Originally Posted by Phantom

I was only spending a few (about 20) seconds in the T spawn ramp covering. Silos is part of CT spawn they spawn right next to the latter up there.

I was playing last night on ct side.... 20 seconds in spawn is BS.... it takes me that long to get over to your spawn from ct spawn, and you (and like 2 others) were eithor on your t ramp(coming out of your spawn), or behind the fence, and sometimes all the way up in your spawn.... and this happened every round until the admin did something about it....

BTW, Silos is not part of the CT spawn, and ct's do not spawn right next to the ladder, it takes atleast 5-8 seconds to get to the top of the silo and that's if you have a good spawn point.....

Originally Posted by BigScott

.... 20 seconds in spawn is BS....

You were CT side, not T side, BS! :10 :10 :10