Business Innovation vs Social Convention

**Warprosper** · 10-03-13, 10:07 AM

"2) Because tips cannot legally, in most cases, be controlled by the employer, they are typically distributed (or not distributed, as the case may be) according to a social compact among the employees. To the extent that the ruls of the compact are enforced, enforcement is through social means, like ostracization. In either event, the systems for both acquiring and distributing tips are easily gamed by members of the serving staff who are intent on doing so."

This has always bothered me... Why does the shitty waitress get distributions from the fantastic waitress. I understand it from the business perspective, but there is just too much that can go wrong with it..

**CivilWars** · 10-03-13, 10:09 AM

Originally Posted by triggerhappy2005

I throw stones at everybody?

News to me.

Glad I could enlighten you. You are welcome.

**CivilWars** · 10-03-13, 10:10 AM

Originally Posted by Warprosper

"2) Because tips cannot legally, in most cases, be controlled by the employer, they are typically distributed (or not distributed, as the case may be) according to a social compact among the employees. To the extent that the ruls of the compact are enforced, enforcement is through social means, like ostracization. In either event, the systems for both acquiring and distributing tips are easily gamed by members of the serving staff who are intent on doing so."

This has always bothered me... Why does the shitty waitress get distributions from the fantastic waitress. I understand it from the business perspective, but there is just too much that can go wrong with it..

This is also dumb, and any intelligent restaurant owner/manager doesn't pool tips.

**Warprosper** · 10-03-13, 10:12 AM

Originally Posted by CivilWars

This is also dumb, and any intelligent restaurant owner/manager doesn't pool tips.

I know quite a few that do... And just about every golf course I go to has their caddies do the same.. I don't like it at all...

**triggerhappy2005** · 10-03-13, 10:13 AM

Originally Posted by CivilWars

Glad I could enlighten you. You are welcome.

You didn't because I don't.

I think you're using this as a way of saying you don't like how I criticize the US.

**Warprosper** · 10-03-13, 10:15 AM

Back to the OP....

This is a fantastic read.. I encourage you to read all the continuations... Good stuff..

**CivilWars** · 10-03-13, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by triggerhappy2005

You didn't because I don't.

I think you're using this as a way of saying you don't like how I criticize the US.

No, I don't like the way you criticize everyone and everything. The US is just one of many topics you look down your nose at. But what makes it worse is when you look down your nose and belittle people that are likely in the same demographic as you considering you are a business owner that if memory serves me correctly pays himself a fairly hefty salary. Yes, I know, all of your employees make more than you because you are the true giver, right?

As I said, it just gets old, but back to the OP.

**AetheLove** · 10-03-13, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by Warprosper

"2) Because tips cannot legally, in most cases, be controlled by the employer, they are typically distributed (or not distributed, as the case may be) according to a social compact among the employees. To the extent that the ruls of the compact are enforced, enforcement is through social means, like ostracization. In either event, the systems for both acquiring and distributing tips are easily gamed by members of the serving staff who are intent on doing so."

This has always bothered me... Why does the shitty waitress get distributions from the fantastic waitress. I understand it from the business perspective, but there is just too much that can go wrong with it..

I think his point was that he wants to eliminate this entire other mini/social economy that operates inside the business. Cooks and dishwashers definitely contribute to service, and though in some places they receive a cut, in most places they either don't get anything or the wait-staff hold back. Additionally, sharing between wait-staff is another mini-game that either gets played wrong or not at all.

He doesn't want the good waitress to get more, and the shitty waitress to get less. He wants to train his staff, and pay them to do a job. He wants the shitty waitress to get better, or get fired. He wants to set a standard of service that applies across the entire staff, and he wants them to be aware that they are one part of an integrated process that requires a cooperative effort to do well.

Cheers,

AetheLove

**triggerhappy2005** · 10-03-13, 10:26 AM

Originally Posted by CivilWars

No, I don't like the way you criticize everyone and everything. The US is just one of many topics you look down your nose at. But what makes it worse is when you look down your nose and belittle people that are likely in the same demographic as you considering you are a business owner that if memory serves me correctly pays himself a fairly hefty salary. Yes, I know, all of your employees make more than you because you are the true giver, right?

As I said, it just gets old, but back to the OP.

You're overreacting.

Back to the OP.

**Warprosper** · 10-03-13, 10:27 AM

Originally Posted by AetheLove

I think his point was that he wants to eliminate this entire other mini/social economy that operates inside the business. Cooks and dishwashers definitely contribute to service, and though in some places they receive a cut, in most places they either don't get anything or the wait-staff hold back. Additionally, sharing between wait-staff is another mini-game that either gets played wrong or not at all.

He doesn't want the good waitress to get more, and the shitty waitress to get less. He wants to train his staff, and pay them to do a job. He wants the shitty waitress to get better, or get fired. He wants to set a standard of service that applies across the entire staff, and he wants them to be aware that they are one part of an integrated process that requires a cooperative effort to do well.

Cheers,

AetheLove

I like how he describes tipping as a deterrent of motivation instead of an inhibitor. Now that I think about it, he's absolutely right.

He also mentions in part 4 I think, about the other restaurant and their tipping strategy. He mentions how no one read the no-tipping text and were surprised about the sudden hike in drink prices. I think that he's onto something with this strategy and if he had a good marketing strategy in a large city, this idea would be extremely successful on a global scale.