The bible says

**chray00** · 09-13-11, 07:01 PM

Originally Posted by deathgodusmc

Im just taking shots in general about the holes in the entire thing. As an example.

Romans 13:8-10

Owe no one anything, except to love each other, for the one who loves another has fulfilled the law. ⁹For the commandments, "You shall not commit adultery, You shall not murder, You shall not steal, You shall not covet," and any other commandment, are summed up in this word: "You shall love your neighbor as yourself." ¹⁰Love does no wrong to a neighbor; therefore love is the fulfilling of the law.

Im curious as to how this applies to credit cards, auto loans, and home loans.

Luke 12:33

Sell your possessions, and give to the needy. Provide yourselves with moneybags that do not grow old, with a treasure in the heavens that does not fail, where no thief approaches and no moth destroys.

Why should i sell my boat and car when the pastor has no problem driving a mercedes?

I could go on but you get my point.

Well duh, the bible was obviously written by the soviets in an attempt to convert us to their doctrine. They brainwashed us to make us believe this religion existed for 2000 years.

Never heard of water fluoridation?

**WickedTribe** · 09-13-11, 07:04 PM

Originally Posted by PvtPrivate

You are almost proving my point.I did not try to insult or offended you.I stated that not all Atheist act that way.I just stated my opinion.You insulted me and tried to devalue my simple opinion.You can post as many bill boards,TV ads,clips of radical Christians as you want but in every day ,person to person discussion I don't see any Christian Oppression.The vast majority of both religious and Atheist are apathetic towards other's beliefs.But there is a small group that spews out hate on both sides.I want to make this clear I am not attacking all Atheist,I have several Atheist friends who could care less about all of this.I am merely pointing out that some Atheist are extremely hypocritical on this issue.It pisses me off when some Atheist act like they are some kind of elite, enlightened,innocent group when they can act just as rudely as any religious zealot.

What saddens me is that I thought this community was mature enough to be above this level,but I can't judge them because I haven't lived there lives.

You need thicker skin. I didn't insult you, I called out your statement as wrong. You were clearly making the case that atheists are more likely to insult you or push their stance on you, and that's simply wrong.

Edit: Also, there's nothing hypocritical about an atheist calling religion stupid, or saying that it's wrong. Atheism has nothing to do with open-mindedness or respect of others' opinions, it's just a lack of belief in god.

**deathgodusmc** · 09-13-11, 07:11 PM

Originally Posted by Sosiego

I was saying doubtful to "exact opposite." I'll grant that people can come up with different interpretations but I find it doubtful someone is going to come up with an interpretation that is the "exact opposite." That would like someone interpreting that Satan is the "father of lies" as Satan is the "father of truth."

I did not say all passages can be but many can.

Originally Posted by Sosiego

Are you saying that copies are hand me downs and hearsay? Have you researched the transmission of the New Testament? It was done specifically to avoid such issues coming up.

Let me put it this way. Say you hand write a paper and say that copy machines do not exist. Say that someone wants to make a copy of your paper, for whatever reason. This would mean that someone, or yourself, would need to sit down with your paper, blank paper, and a pen/pencil and hand write a copy. Would you consider that copy created to be a hand me down or hearsay?

Im saying that the book is the same as a a story. Over time it becomes embellished, missing parts, missing letters in words that can change the meaning of them, and so forth. Without the original the story can not be told as intended regardless of how well intended the people translating were.

Do you really think a well documental trail for the new testiment erases all the gaps from before it? Do you really think absolutely nothing was lost in its translations? Do you really believe there are no gaps in its history? To be honest i think your example falls pretty far from reality.

Originally Posted by Sosiego

Again, what you mean by version? Translations?

Each time it is translated you end up with a new book because those translations are not complete due to everything does not translate perfectly across from one language to another.

Originally Posted by Sosiego

When you say "its just a belief," what exactly are you referring to? That modern English translations, as well as older English translations such as the KJV, are the word of God?

My apologies for all the questions but I'm trying to figure just what you're exact issue is. If it's the modern "there's lots of different translations so therefore there is no word of God" argument then I'll address that issue - which stems from (presumably) a misconception as to what inspiration and inerrancy are. If it's not, I need you to tell me what you're getting at exactly.

Religion as a whole is just a belief. God did not write the book man did. We all know far to well that men are liars and will pass tales for their benefit. Who is to say that is not the exact reason the very first bible was written? There is absolutely 0 proof that anything in the bible accured.

Don't get me wrong there is nothing wrong with having belief. If that is what you need or want by all means ride out. However trying to pass it off as factual and correct information is dishonest. Many wars have been fought over this and for what? People kill in the name of god without a single shread of evidence that one exsists or that the bible has 1 piece of anything real.

No need apoligize i've been thru this before myself many times to the point i have seriously upset some pastors. One my wife was not so happy i did that to. In the end you have to ask yourself a few simple questions. If we couldn't have just appeared how the hell did he? Why do people believe so much in a book written by man knowing full well men are liars? If there truely was a god that was mercifull why do so many suffer?

The answer becomes crystal clear. The bible is a farse in which it is actually the very first pyramid scam.

**fly351** · 09-13-11, 07:27 PM

lol @ OP

**deathgodusmc** · 09-13-11, 07:49 PM

Yeah i think we left that way the fuck behind us.

**DJ Ms. White** · 09-13-11, 07:56 PM

I am Mr. White, and I approve of any thread jackings as Prince of the Postwhores and the Earl of Threadstarting.

**Sosiego** · 09-13-11, 07:58 PM

Originally Posted by deathgodusmc

Im saying that the book is the same as a a story. Over time it becomes embellished, missing parts, missing letters in words that can change the meaning of them, and so forth. Without the original the story can not be told as intended regardless of how well intended the people translating were.

Do you really think a well documental trail for the new testiment erases all the gaps from before it? Do you really think absolutely nothing was lost in its translations? Do you really believe there are no gaps in its history? To be honest i think your example falls pretty far from reality.

And what I'm saying is that there is no empirical evidence within the manuscript tradition that this happened with the New Testament, nor the Old Testament for that matter. So, again, I ask: Have you researched the transmission of the New Testament? As I said before, it was done specifically to avoid such issues.

And, again, they weren't translating it. They were making copies.

Originally Posted by deathgodusmc

Each time it is translated you end up with a new book because those translations are not complete due to everything does not translate perfectly across from one language to another.

Right, that works with translation. However, that was not how it was done with the original transmission of the New Testament. They took the originals written in Koine Greek and made copies in Koine Greek, just like in the example I provided to you. Hence why we have Koine Greek manuscripts.

Originally Posted by deathgodusmc

If we couldn't have just appeared how the hell did he? Why do people believe so much in a book written by man knowing full well men are liars? If there truely was a god that was mercifull why do so many suffer?

I would think you know that He didn't "just appear." He's the uncaused cause, always was and always will be.

As for "written by man," that has to do with the method of inspiration chosen by God. The Bible was not given by means of what is called the dictation theory. We believe in what is called the plenary inspiration of Scripture. Men, superintended by the Holy Spirit in order so there words would be free from error while still maintaining the author's style (as well allowing what was written to be relevant both to the immediate historical context as well as future contexts), were the ones with the pen and papyri (see 2 Pet. 1:19-21).

As for the issue of suffering, well, that could take a while and, honestly, not to dodge the issue but there are plenty of works that have been written on that subject that could speak better to it than I can. Given that I'm a Reformed Protestant, I'm of course going to have a different answer than most evangelical Christians you meet and, as such, should you actually want to pursue a Reformed answer I'd recommend checking out D. A. Carson's How Long, O Lord?. You're welcome to discuss that issue with me over PMs or e-mail.

**PvtPrivate** · 09-13-11, 08:08 PM

Originally Posted by WickedTribe

You need thicker skin. I didn't insult you, I called out your statement as wrong. You were clearly making the case that atheists are more likely to insult you or push their stance on you, and that's simply wrong.

Edit: Also, there's nothing hypocritical about an atheist calling religion stupid, or saying that it's wrong. Atheism has nothing to do with open-mindedness or respect of others' opinions, it's just a lack of belief in god.

Calling my opinion "uneducated and bullshit and now thick skinned" is an insult in my eyes.In my experience of day to day life I rarely see either bother or even care.I honestly see more Atheist be rude to religious people then vice-veresa in my experiences witch is very rare anyways.Sure you see nutjobs on TV but I haven't come across many of those in real life.Now you could have the exact opposite experiences as me and see religious people being rude to Atheist all the time,and im sure you have but it doesn't mean I'm "simply wrong".Its a manner of perspective based of our life experiences.Its obvious that we have different perspectives butthe main point of my posts is about the hypocrisy some Atheist show in regards to this behavior.

I don't get how Atheist calling religious people stupid isn't hypocritical.Its still a belief,that can't be proven and to insult others is rude.No matter how much more rational you think yours is it is still hypercritical.
Its like a European insulting Somalians and Ethiopians,but when he gets accused racism he says "oh im not an African,only Africans can be racist towards each other,im different then them so I can't be racist"
I have no intentions of offending with you.I simply stated my opinion and you gave what I think is a unfairly harsh response.I do not want to start a fight.I do not see this conversation going anywhere productive.I think we should simply acknowledge each others opinions and move on.

**WickedTribe** · 09-13-11, 08:36 PM

Originally Posted by PvtPrivate

Calling my opinion "uneducated and bullshit and now thick skinned" is an insult in my eyes.In my experience of day to day life I rarely see either bother or even care.I honestly see more Atheist be rude to religious people then vice-veresa in my experiences witch is very rare anyways.Sure you see nutjobs on TV but I haven't come across many of those in real life.Now you could have the exact opposite experiences as me and see religious people being rude to Atheist all the time,and im sure you have but it doesn't mean I'm "simply wrong".Its a manner of perspective based of our life experiences.Its obvious that we have different perspectives butthe main point of my posts is about the hypocrisy some Atheist show in regards to this behavior.

First, I didn't call you or your opinion uneducated, please get your facts straight. Second, your experience may be skewed, or your perspective may be biased, but there are easily attainable facts. We can look at polls where people clearly stated that they wouldn't vote for Atheists, or that Atheists are harming the country. We can look at the number of attempts to get religion codified as law (DOMA, stem cell research bans, abortion, etc) and compare it to the number of attempts to get atheism codified as law (crickets). There are unsupported opinions and there are facts, and only one matters.

Originally Posted by PvtPrivate

I don't get how Atheist calling religious people stupid isn't hypocritical.Its still a belief,that can't be proven and to insult others is rude.No matter how much more rational you think yours is it is still hypercritical.
Its like a European insulting Somalians and Ethiopians,but when he gets accused racism he says "oh im not an African,only Africans can be racist towards each other,im different then them so I can't be racist"
I have no intentions of offending with you.I simply stated my opinion and you gave what I think is a unfairly harsh response.I do not want to start a fight.I do not see this conversation going anywhere productive.I think we should simply acknowledge each others opinions and move on.

I'm not saying this to insult you, but you either don't understand what the word "hypocritical" means, or you don't know what the word "atheist" means.

Hypocritical:
professing feelings or virtues one does not have; "hypocritical praise".

Atheism
Noun: The theory or belief that God does not exist.

Hypocritical doesn't mean "rude."

**PvtPrivate** · 09-13-11, 08:55 PM

Originally Posted by WickedTribe

First, I didn't call you or your opinion uneducated, please get your facts straight. Second, your experience may be skewed, or your perspective may be biased, but there are easily attainable facts. We can look at polls where people clearly stated that they wouldn't vote for Atheists, or that Atheists are harming the country. We can look at the number of attempts to get religion codified as law (DOMA, stem cell research bans, abortion, etc) and compare it to the number of attempts to get atheism codified as law (crickets). There are unsupported opinions and there are facts, and only one matters.

I am willing to accept that my personal experiences/opinion got the better of me and you may be right.But I don't think it should be a contest of who has more assholes.The main point is that this behavior isn't one sided and it makes me angry when people act like it is.

I'm not saying this to insult you, but you either don't understand what the word "hypocritical" means, or you don't know what the word "atheist" means.

Hypocritical:
professing feelings or virtues one does not have; "hypocritical praise".

Atheism
Noun: The theory or belief that God does not exist.

Hypocritical doesn't mean "rude."[/QUOTE]
I dont see how Atheist can't hypocritical.Are you saying since they don't have a religion they can't be hypocrites towards religious people?If an Atheist complains about religious people being rude,and then goes on to be rude to religious people how is that not hypocritical?
EDIT:its not hypocritical for acting rude,its hypocritical because its doing the same behavior your condemning.