Thread: Are people inherently stupid?

Originally Posted by LuckyDucky

Oh so now you're offended... that's cute. If you feel the need to break it down letter by letter then it's your own fault for not being clear in meaning.

Because here is how I saw your post. You said:
1) The flag symbolizes freedom, bullshit, etc. (therefore the flag is a SYMBOL)
2) Many soldiers have died for that flag. (so they've died for a SYMBOL)
3) You think it's offensive... blah blah blah irrelevant stuff... Followed up by suggesting a certain practice be outright BANNED. (that's right you want to take away the people's right to burn a flag, and then you tell ME to pull my head out of my ass, cute)

Not to be offensive or anything, but I genuinely feel bad for anyone who dies for something as volatile and open to interpretation as a cloth symbol for "freedom". Every single veteran that I've had the pleasure of talking to, or listening to speeches from, or reading about. Has always said that they are fighting for the people back home, and THEIR freedoms. Not for some symbol, or some ideal, but for the people back home. Something tangible and actually important.

Would those veterans be HAPPY that those same people are burning the flag? I'm sure they wouldn't be... but i'm also sure that the freedom to burn that flag is MUCH more important than the flag itself. So if the flag symbolizes anything, then it's the people's freedom and right to burn the damn thing.

People's freedoms > a piece of cloth with pretty colors on it that symbolizes freedom

Nope not offended at all. A little surprised that the obvious has escaped you. Now if you go back and read it you will see i said "Personally i think that it should be illegal to desicrate the flag...".

Now im glad you have had the priviledge to talk to people that served but have you ever asked them how they feel about desicrating the flag? You think its not a symbol? Then why do so many people deal with HOA's fines, risk getting fired from jobs, stop in to places with tattered flag and demand they be replaced? Why is it the US flag is the most sold flag in the world year after year? You think its because red, blue, and white just look good together?

If its just a piece of cloth with pretty colors on it then why is it we have an entire US Flag Code? Why is it that there are companies that dispose of the flag in accordance to regulations? I think your trying to trivialise something because you dont understand it. Next time you talk to those vets ask them what they feel about the flag and people desicrating it. Take a look around a VA hospital sometime. I think you'll be surprised how average people can walk in and out of buildings flying that flag with hardly ever taking a glimps at it. Yet with all the times i have been to VA hospitals i have hardly ever seen a vet not look at it even if just for a second.

Originally Posted by LuckyDucky

Now it's you who completely missed the point of my post. I'm not arguing that the flag ISN'T a symbol. It's a symbol no doubt. But just because it symbolizes something doesn't give it value enough to elevate it beyond the rights of people.

No I have not had the chance to ask them about their feelings on the flag's desecration, and I won't because the answer they'll give is beyond obvious. Instead I would ask them this question... and I'll ask it to you as well, anyone reading this really.

If the flag symbolizes freedom, does it not also symbolize the freedom to burn that very same flag as an act of protest? What is the point of symbolizing freedom if that same freedom cannot be applied to the symbol itself?


You're cute. But unhelpful and irrelevant to the discussion. If you agree with him then discuss why you do. If you don't wish to discuss, then leave and quit trying to troll me by calling me a troll.

No it should be above that. The problem is people here love to tell others about their right to free speach. 99% of the time its always someone that never made the choice to be a person that keeps that freedom going. You want to protest thats perfectly fine go burn a book or a picture of what or who your upset with. Burning the flag does nothing for your cause but make you look like a trolling bastard that was to scared to ever dawn that uniform that gives that flag its entire symbolisim.

On a personal sidenote trying to hide behind you've talked to vets so you know what they think on the subject while argueing with a vet thats telling you your wrong is well weak. You wont ask them the question because you already know the answer because i already gave it to you. There will be exceptions here and there but overall you'll find out your thoughts were wrong.

Originally Posted by LuckyDucky

Really... you think a flag is more important than people's rights. Well I hope at some point you realize how ludicrous and backwards that idea is.

I never said I could speak for all Veteran's opinions or even know what they think. I simply pointed out that every single one that I've talked to never fought for some stupid flag. Just because YOU are a veteran doesn't give you the right to speak for other veterans either.

I don't know why you insist on glorifying the flag as some ultimate symbol of patriotism, but alright.

You not having the understanding doesnt make something ludicrous or backwards. Why you dont understand why the flag is the ultimate symbol of patriotism is what baffles me. I truely think you dont know all that goes into it. Let me give you a military standpoint on how valuable the flag is. Did you know the ball at the top of every flag pole on every base contains 2 items? If the base is over run you are required by military law to climb the pole and remove the ball and flag. Then you remove the matches and burn the flag and use the round to kill yourself. Now why would they go thru all the trouble for that if the flag was nothing more then a piece of cloth with pretty colors on it?

Originally Posted by CivilWars

Not sure if it's true, but snopes is usually pretty accurate.

snopes.com: Flagpost Gold Ball Contents

Its taught to every marine in boot camp, its one of the possible questions at a meritorous mast, and is in every USMC handbook issued at bootcamp. I doubts snopes has it right.