Second teams' Tank Spawn Distance Variation

**Train wreck** · 06-13-11, 05:31 PM

I have a lot of appreciation for the randomness that L4D can become and I'm fine with witches being in different positions but tanks are a different story, their impact is far too great to simply say "Oh well, deal with it." Most of us know there are tanks spawns that are either extremely easy or very difficult and sometimes both can fall within that '5%' window. Also I'd like to remind everyone that tanks often spawn closer to the beginning of a map and therefore can have a large impact on the outcome.

If this were the opposite and tanks spawned later I would say we should leave it be because often times your average team is down around the midway point anyway. I'll also say if this were the case having that "5% variance" would be great in a competitive game because the potential point advantage would probably be around 200 or so instead of 300+, which is usually what it amounts to when a team gets screwed by a tank spawn. By that I mean there would be a good amount of pressure to overcome that late tank to either catch up or maintain a lead. In this case I think keeping it at 5% is great because most teams aren't at full health later in rounds which can make playing a tank very difficult regardless of location.

In my opinion perhaps we should try delaying a tank spawn until after the midway point and closer to 3/4 of a map before changing the variance.

**Kanati** · 06-13-11, 05:42 PM

Originally Posted by Adretheon

The problem, for me, with the way it was was the point system. Both teams would get the same points regardless of the amount of work they had to put into beating the game. So one team had to fight twice as hard to get into the saferoom cause they didn't get T2, but got just as many points as the other team who had T3, three pipes, bile, and a million pills.

Point system is what needs to be fixed more so than anything.

That's another thing I think is funny. Everyone bitched up a storm about the scoring system in L4D1. And when they came out with L4D2 and changed it everyone loved it. And now everyone bitches about the scoring and want to use confogl.............. which is basically the scoring system from L4D1.

**¤[BlitzKrieg]¤** · 06-13-11, 06:34 PM

Originally Posted by Kanati8869

That's another thing I think is funny. Everyone bitched up a storm about the scoring system in L4D1. And when they came out with L4D2 and changed it everyone loved it. And now everyone bitches about the scoring and want to use confogl.............. which is basically the scoring system from L4D1.

There aren't lame ass med kits that give insta bonus and keep people alive at all times... Get in with low HP but your health kit in L4D1, UBER BONUS!!!!!!! In L4D2... Low HP or temp HP means you get none of those lame points.

**¤[BlitzKrieg]¤** · 06-13-11, 06:35 PM

Originally Posted by maximusboomus

C to the O to the N to the Fogl.

I giggled. And smiled. And then made sweet love to Max.

**Lefty** · 06-13-11, 10:20 PM

Originally Posted by Kanati8869

Bunni. I honestly don't know how long you've been playing, but these are all things Valve did... When the game came out items were randomized. One team would get guns in one place and the other team had them spawn somewhere else. They did this to promote shopping and slow things down a bit. If the teams wanted those guns and pills and such they had to look for them. It didn't work and people bitched. So they got rid of that and made uniform spawns for both teams.

The tanks and witches used to be random spawns for both teams. People bitched that teams had unfair advantages... So them made them have much smaller variances. Witches, if wandering, can have quite a wide variance, but sitting witches are usually within 10 feet or so of the first team's spawned witch. Tanks are within 5% of the map distance from the first team's spawned tank. 95% of the time it doesn't make one bit of difference. And when it does it's a crapshoot as to who it'll favor.

I like that TPG doesn't mod the shit out of their servers. That's always been a plus for me. And now we're talking about modding them (even if it's only slightly). Not the coolest thing I've heard lately. :/

Agreed 100%

No matter what we do, some players will always bitch.
imho, Realism random. CONFOGL fixed, make your choice with the lobby.

**Morningfrost** · 06-13-11, 11:24 PM

Originally Posted by Lefty

Agreed 100%

No matter what we do, some players will always bitch.
imho, Realism random. CONFOGL fixed, make your choice with the lobby.

Exactly, I'm going to bitch every time Lefty, it's what I do

**Sawemoff** · 06-14-11, 02:33 PM

I really hate the, " we dealt with it in the past so everyone should now " argument. It in NO way has meant that the way it WAS is best. Sometimes change is good, and of course everyone will find something to bitch about. The problem here the effectiveness of a tank is heavily dependent upon spawn location and NO other aspect in the game has the ability to singly incap all 4 survivors. Now if you are just interesting in playing for the sake of playing, then random is great. If you like playing competitively then random sucks. Its just an opinion and no matter what happens we are all going to keep playing. I would say that if a larger portion of the player base thinks its a good change than its something that should be considered.

**Gonzo0100** · 06-14-11, 03:29 PM

The witch is in a fixed location, IMO the tank should be as well. You should get the bonus (knowing where) if you are losing and playing SI first. In an ideal world the game should make each round (for each team) exactly the same, tanks, witches, guns, nades etc....

I think I am a middle ground player, a few hundred in L4D1, 120ish (i think) in L4D2.... still a noob compared to the high level players but I usually dont get picked last (as much as frost hates it).

**Morningfrost** · 06-14-11, 03:52 PM

Originally Posted by Gonzo0100

The witch is in a fixed location, IMO the tank should be as well. You should get the bonus (knowing where) if you are losing and playing SI first. In an ideal world the game should make each round (for each team) exactly the same, tanks, witches, guns, nades etc....

I think I am a middle ground player, a few hundred in L4D1, 120ish (i think) in L4D2.... still a noob compared to the high level players but I usually dont get picked last (as much as frost hates it).

Wait, you play L4D2? lol.

Just gotta work on my consistency Gonz, then we'll see which of us gets picked before the other

And I don't get picked last these days either lol. Early when I started playin again yeah, cause I was rusty as hell lol. Now I'm usually around the 2nd or 3rd picked unless it's an all-vet game, then I get the fat kid pick lol.

**Kanati** · 06-14-11, 05:03 PM

Originally Posted by Sawemoff

The problem here the effectiveness of a tank is heavily dependent upon spawn location and NO other aspect in the game has the ability to singly incap all 4 survivors.

The effectiveness of the tank is heavily dependent on whether *I* am controlling it or not.

Ok... So lets say we make the change... And all tanks start in the same position between rounds. Ok... Lets look at this hypothetical then. Tank spawns on the picnic table where ammo is at on Darny 2 outside the safe room door. First team is all ZOMG... and get taken down by the tank. It happens. Can't win em all, right?

Team 2? They know EXACTLY where that tank is going to spawn. Guess what? They molly the picnic table. And rush forward to spawn the tank. In the fire. Then they run back to the safe room area and kite the tank along while they shoot it. Dead tank.

Knowing EXACTLY where that tank was going to spawn just lost team 1 the game because you can now EASILY guarantee fire on the tank if you have a molly.

Why do you think there's a 5% difference now? You think the devs just pulled that number out of their asses for shits and grins? It's so the above scenario doesn't happen. That very thing can cause a 600 point swing and that's not really acceptable.