CSS and Admin judgement calls...

**sL!ppY** · 11-13-08, 10:21 PM

Now i am in no way a poster child for TTP. Ive had my share of run ins with admins and players. Some may say i walk a thin line quite often and i don't strait out deny that. I am a competitive person and i am sometimes run by my emotions more than my common sense. But i also have the gaming history. I have played so many styles, types, classes of games that it still surprises me. I have been an admin on servers before in other games... i have helped run teams before, and i have played on several heavily competitive teams/guilds.

So.. with that said.. i wanted to bring to light a few things Ive noticed. Please take this simply as my opinion and voice. TTP is run the way the ownership sees fit and the admins are not appointed lightly. I don't have the right to tell anyone what to do here... and justly so. However the admins are human and humans make mistakes. I have noticed a lot more "judgement" calls being made by admins recently that just seem downright wrong and blatantly incorrect. One example of this would be the berating and/or slaying by the admin of folks for not attempting to plant the bomb when there is upwards of a minute left in the round and they are moving and not camping. Another would be the slaying of someone for team flashing when it was not them. Another would be an admin making a judgement that someone was not following the call when the person was.. but the admin had no knowledge of what the call was. What I'm trying to say here is that it seems like admin "mistakes" are on the rise. I know your job is tough... and i thank you for putting up with some of the stuff you do..... However a kick, ban, slay, or even accusation should NOT be made... if you are "guessing".

Also.. because each admin is a unique person, each admin will call each situation how they see it and make a decision that often times is not uniform to all other admins decisions. However having an admin let people get away with basically everything under the sun one day.. and then having an admin banning left and right the next day just doesn't seem fair. People don't know whats allowed and whats going to be punishable on a daily basis. Also... if regs are held to a higher standard.. then why do some folks get punished for something a reg just did the previous round (Believe me it happens a hell of a lot).

I don't doubt ill take some heat for this post... hell i might even get a temp ban. But it needed to come out. I have heard so much trash talked recently about how the "admins" are doing a poor job and that's never a good thing when folks are talking like that. I also have been very disappointed with several events Ive observed where an admin made a judgement call that I and often times many in the server thought was quite poorly made.

So with that said.. please at least think about whats in my post. If you want to ignore it i have no problem with that. And keep in mind that i am not telling TTP nor its admins how to do their jobs... its your show.. we just are here for the ride. But sometimes someone has to step up and say something.. give some input.

-loyal TTP fan slippy

**DJ Ms. White** · 11-13-08, 10:30 PM

Any names of the abusers you want to throw out? Saying there's a problem without saying who causes the problem is not helpful.

**QuickLightning** · 11-13-08, 10:31 PM

Hmm...

Sl!ppy, while I really appreciate the tone and profession nature of this post, It would really help us process an actual admin abuse claim and right whatever is being done wrong if we had a bit more information. The examples you are citing are a bit vague and also do not include names/dates/times in which we could reference logs to validate the situation and judge for ourselves whether or not abuse occurred in said situation.

As you said yourself, admins are not appointed lightly and are held to VERY strict standards. Any form of abuse of their powers could lead to suspension/termination of their duties.

If you wouldn't mind elaborating a bit and citing your examples with some times/dates, it would really help us out.

Thanks.

**CivilWars** · 11-13-08, 10:43 PM

Slippy,

To some extent I can agree with you. If I drive down any road I know what the posted speed limit is. I know that if I exceed that speed limit then there is the possibility that I could be ticketed. Some officers make the decision to stop any person exceeding the limit by 1 MPH, others may let it go up to 5 or even 10, some others might stop people up to 5 with a warning, but ticket those that are over 5. The law is still the same, but the officer has the discretion to enforce the law however he chooses within reason.

The same holds true on TTP, within reason. Some admins might choose to warn, others slay, some kick, and more ban. I know I personally am different from day to day, or even map to map. If there are 8 asshats on my team, and none of them are helping, then I am much less tolerant, and odds are good you will get slayed for any minor infraction, then banned for talking crap about it. If however it is one player for one round odds are good you will get a verbal or god chat warning first, then harsher punishment if it continues.

As for admins making decisions without truly knowing what was going on I am not going to say it does not happen, but I will say it is rare. MOST of the time there are multiple admins on, and at least one on each team. If your team goes A, and you kill me B, the admin on my team will usually ask the admin on yours if you were supposed to be there. If so then no worries, but if not then you get what you deserve. Do admins make mistakes? I know I do. The other night I slayed the wrong guy because 2 players had almost identical names. I apologized, and he was cool with it. But based on my limited experience I feel we have the best admins in the business. If people have complaints they might need to also take a look at their own style of play.

Civil

**sL!ppY** · 11-13-08, 10:49 PM

White and Lightning.. I did not want to accuse anyone in particular for 2 reasons. I firstly did not want to call names when they are just trying to do their jobs. My post was meant to be more feedback if anything. Also... i did not always know who the admin was making the "judgement" call. The admins are anonymous for a reason and while i could easily make assumptions or guess as to who they are based on my knowledge accumulated over my time spent at TTP... i would still only be making a "guess".

I'm not saying they are purposely abusing their power... just trying to provide some insight and perhaps request a review on how certain situations are handled. Then again this is just my opinion... nothing more.. and i don't help run the show.

I will in the future attempt to document any particular situations such as the ones i mentioned. This post was prompted by a situation that happend tonight involving the berating of a player by an admin for not trying to plant when there was plenty of time left, the player followed the call, and the player was making progress. I did however not document it because as i said above.. i was not planing to file an admin abuse claim... and just was giving an opinion.

Also... thanks civil for that response. I couldn't agree more with your comments and appreciate your views. I also think that TTP has some of the best admins in the business but at the same time i think that there is room for improvement.

**sacredsarcasm** · 11-14-08, 07:39 AM

abuse is always taken very seriously and we appreciate and expect our regulars to watch the admins just like the admins watch regs. get some evidence and witnesses to a specific event and something can be done, but unfortunately this doesnt really tell us much. :2

**w4jchosen** · 11-14-08, 10:12 AM

Anything else or can this be locked?

**sL!ppY** · 11-14-08, 07:16 PM

If you wish to lock it by all means go ahead.. as i stated it was meant to just bring forward my opinion (and bring out concerns brought fourth by others behind the backs of admins). I was kinda hoping to get some internal discussion going on by the admins as to how to address certain situations or behavior. It was not a direct admin abuse claim towards any individual. I made my point and hopefully it was understood for what it was. Thanks for reading.

**GoldElite** · 11-14-08, 07:25 PM

on a lighter note...I LOVE YOU GUYS!

AND I HATE ASSHATS IN SERVERS!!!!

Admins rule!!!

**vafaskillz** · 11-14-08, 08:16 PM

Slippy, I have been an admin here since 2005 and we all have our bad days...it happens. Civil said it perfectly with his speeding ticket analogy and I couldn't agree more with him. However, I definitely diasagree that this is a reoccurring problem. I never witness any of these things happening when I am on and I feel our 40 admins do a hell of a job. Sure, a lot of people think that when I am on things are perfect. I actually play under a few different steam IDs just so I can keep a tab on our admins and make sure things get done properly when I am not on. I think of it as quality control and not micromanagement. I honestly have only great things to say about the way our CS admins handle there day to day business and I do not agree with any accusations or comments you have made. If you notice things happening, then we need details or the abuse claim will be ignored. With all do respect to those who think we are not doing our job, quit your whining or come in with a legitamate abuse claim.