Accidental team stacking

**sickwookie** · 06-05-09, 08:09 AM

I have watched this happen several times now, and have been on both sides of it. It was not until last night that I realized exactly what was going on though.

The scenario:

Map loads and there are several regular team players who auto join red, blu
3-4 regulars end up on one team and 1-2 end up on the other
The 1-2 regulars on the weaker team beat their heads against the wall trying to get their team organized:
- We don't need 3 spys
- We don't need 3 snipers
- Medic don't run in with your needle gun hang back and build an uber
- etc.
The 1-2 regulars on the weaker team get frustrated after a round or two and switch to Top5 or just quit for the night.
The remaining 3-4 regulars on the other team steamroll for the remaining rounds before the map change
Rinse, Repeat

I think that it is the responsibility of the good team players to try and balance the teams before we get to the rage quit stage. If the first round was a decent fight and the second a blowout one or two of the top players should be switching teams. I will be doing this in the future when I see this situation developing, and I hope some others will join me as well.

Even better we should all be checking the teams during the waiting for players round and try to switch if we see this kind of imbalance developing.

**Consultant** · 06-05-09, 08:16 AM

Not that it's enforcable - but if you are a reg, and you bail on a team to change servers for a better game, you aren't doing your job as a regular. You who are here, and have reserved slots, and wisdom of teamplay to know the value of it...Talk to your team, if they dont respond, talk to the admins.

In all chat, type "@ The Blu Team is not balancing classes, 3 snipers, 3 spies, we're asking them to change and they are not."

That message will go DIRECTLY to the admins and an admin will address the situation immediately.

Basically, the admins need the REGULARS and reservists to help them police the server.

Bailing (bitching) out to change servers because you drew a tough team who isnt working together is the BS way out.

**sickwookie** · 06-05-09, 10:27 AM

I understand what you are saying Consultant, but there are still times where a team is simply out classed. Lets say I get those three snipers down to one, but the players are just not that good. Your team is still going to get rolled when you are up against a few of the better regulars on TTP.

My point is that if you are one of the guys that always turns up as an MVP check the scoreboard and balance things out when it is clear there is a discrepancy in skill between the two teams. I know that it does not happen on purpose, but it does happen so be aware of it.

**Gonzo0100** · 06-05-09, 10:45 AM

I hear you on this. I popped in Dustbowl offense 2:2. We were getting worked, I screamed, yelled, stomped my feet. We rallied a bit, but lost. Then we got rolled a little bit for the next 2 stages on Dustbowl defense. By the final cap we had balanced out the teams and were able to hold 3:1 for almost 10 minutes. Then we proceeded to stomp out the team trying to cap 3:2. It was awesome and the reason why TTP is the shit.

We had some epic back and forth on Gravelpit last night as well. GG!

Yeah, call the admin, get on your mic and give the ass-hats an ear full. If they dont listen to you trying to get the team together, they are not teamplayers and an admin needs to be notified of there bullshit.

@ The player name "mutedipshit" is just running around not backing anyone up!

You will probably see a warning in god chat and then a swift hand if "mutedipshit" doesn't game up.

**enf** · 06-05-09, 11:17 AM

Usually if you ask the regs on the opposing side to switch when you are obviously getting steam-rolled, they will kindly oblige. Some like the challenge of being the underdog. Just dont expect the teams to automatically juggle around if you get rolled on say one part of a pl map. If its consistent though... Just get vocal to the regs.

**Riot_Starter** · 06-05-09, 11:17 AM

I agree with most of what is said here, but asking an admin for help is completely worthless when there is no admin. The most annoying situations to me are when I am the only reg on the team (out of maybe 2-3 on the server) and trying to get a team with 4 snipers and 2 spies on offense(just happened to me about 5 minutes ago) and I message an admin for help only to get no response. This is a very frustrating experience. I stick around and try my best to get the team together, but it's very difficult with only 1 person trying to get half the team to change classes.

Now that summer has come, I think we need more (read: at least 1) admin on from around 11am when people start playing on the server. Although this may not be possible, a guy can dream can't he. :3

**SiderFace** · 06-05-09, 11:44 AM

We all love playing TTP servers because we like the player base. We like the standards that are set: friendly, competative play based around team work. TF2 can be palyed on any server; hell! we could start our own. But, GREAT TF2 play is a bit more rare.

The problem I'm presenting is the regulars who carry soem weight that CLEARLY do not carry the same values as the majority. Recently, I have WATCHED many players (regs) WAIT for the opportunity to join a specific team. At times it is pretty bad. So bad that we start a new map , and we almost finish a complete round (or DO), and we still have 5 or more spectators watiing to get the team they desire. I usually watch, and wait before i judge... then SURE ENOUGH! ALL 5 of them systematciall wait for their chance to join that team. And they usually do it SHAMELESSLY with team join (NOT auto-assign). I can't even REMEMBER the last time i hit "red" or "blue" door on the team select screen. My point is... I will stake my life that it is not always accidental. But, I will probably never name any particualr names; that ruins the joy of beating them when they DO stack

However, I DO agree that rallying back with an underdog team is my favorite thing to do. I like it WAY more than rolling a team. Its the ESSENCE of enjoyable TF2. [ I just used the word "essence" :-Þ ]

I mostly jsut blame a higher level of garbage/random players. I think that there used to be more of a consistent base of solid players. There are MORE players lately, but less good palyers. There seems to be alot of retardation in general, and you can bet it is ALWAYS some dude I've never seen playing before. I don't expect players to have pro skills; in fact, I don't even think its completely necessary. Each team needs 2-3 high-skill players, but if the rest of the team plays smart, feels out the situation(s), fulfills their class's role, and communicates... the team will at least contend (even if they lose in the end).

I will have to say that TTP is still hookin me up with the best matches. I tried to go around to other servers to see if I was crazy... and i was... the matches are still best on TTP. Theres nowhere better to go to get a good pickup game.

**Oozish** · 06-05-09, 12:54 PM

Call out some names otherwise this isn't going to help much.

Also, yesterday on dustbowl 2 I was on the winning team and we rolled them basically to the second point and then I switched to defending team to make the game more even/challenging. We ended up holding them off there too, which I really didn't expect.

I like being on the weaker side, I try to see what difference I can make; sometimes it's just too overwhelming when a lot of people just don't know what to do, but sometimes you can really change things around. I like the underdog position (pervs!)

**SJA** · 06-05-09, 01:56 PM

Originally Posted by SiderFace

We all love playing TTP servers because we like the player base. We like the standards that are set: friendly, competative play based around team work. TF2 can be palyed on any server; hell! we could start our own. But, GREAT TF2 play is a bit more rare.

The problem I'm presenting is the regulars who carry soem weight that CLEARLY do not carry the same values as the majority. Recently, I have WATCHED many players (regs) WAIT for the opportunity to join a specific team. At times it is pretty bad. So bad that we start a new map , and we almost finish a complete round (or DO), and we still have 5 or more spectators watiing to get the team they desire. I usually watch, and wait before i judge... then SURE ENOUGH! ALL 5 of them systematciall wait for their chance to join that team. And they usually do it SHAMELESSLY with team join (NOT auto-assign). I can't even REMEMBER the last time i hit "red" or "blue" door on the team select screen. My point is... I will stake my life that it is not always accidental. But, I will probably never name any particualr names; that ruins the joy of beating them when they DO stack

However, I DO agree that rallying back with an underdog team is my favorite thing to do. I like it WAY more than rolling a team. Its the ESSENCE of enjoyable TF2. [ I just used the word "essence" :-Þ ]

I mostly jsut blame a higher level of garbage/random players. I think that there used to be more of a consistent base of solid players. There are MORE players lately, but less good palyers. There seems to be alot of retardation in general, and you can bet it is ALWAYS some dude I've never seen playing before. I don't expect players to have pro skills; in fact, I don't even think its completely necessary. Each team needs 2-3 high-skill players, but if the rest of the team plays smart, feels out the situation(s), fulfills their class's role, and communicates... the team will at least contend (even if they lose in the end).

I will have to say that TTP is still hookin me up with the best matches. I tried to go around to other servers to see if I was crazy... and i was... the matches are still best on TTP. Theres nowhere better to go to get a good pickup game.

I thought a lot of this was covered in the team stacking thread we had recently. Just because regs get together on a team doesnt mean they will win, Ive been on the receiving end of an ass whoopin from a team of unknowns. If things are one-sided though, responsible regs should mix it up. I'm usually one of the first 3-6 people loaded after a map change, and Im usually racing Consultant. Sometimes we wind up on the same team, sometimes we dont. Sometimes I take a piss break on map change and come back after the majority of people are in. Joining late doesnt necessarily mean someone is trying to stack. Clannies winding up on the same team through auto join doesnt mean they are gaming the system to stack. Its more work and trouble trying to NOT stack by watching whos joining and picking a specific side. Just auto join, and sort it out after a round or two, its pretty obvious that teams are imbalanced after that. If people are sticking together after a round or two, call them out, if they still do it, bring it up with an admin or on the boards if they are part of the problem.

**enf** · 06-05-09, 02:07 PM

Originally Posted by Oozish

Call out some names otherwise this isn't going to help much.

Also, yesterday on dustbowl 2 I was on the winning team and we rolled them basically to the second point and then I switched to defending team to make the game more even/challenging. We ended up holding them off there too, which I really didn't expect.

I like being on the weaker side, I try to see what difference I can make; sometimes it's just too overwhelming when a lot of people just don't know what to do, but sometimes you can really change things around. I like the underdog position (pervs!)

It only betters you that much more with actually having a challenge in front of you...